Callisto Protocol is a FLOP (5/10 at GS)

[Goukosan 2,250]

1 hour ago, Remij said:

Who really gives a fuck?  It should have never released in this state in the first place.  It has to be the biggest piece of shit for stuttering that I've ever seen.

 

What good are jump scares when you have a second or two of stutter to warn you they're about to happen? 

 

These cunts don't deserve any money for this shit even if they fix it.  The gall to release the game like that in the first place is not to be rewarded.

 

PC version should have been delayed. 

[Goukosan 2,250]

25 minutes ago, jehurey said:

wait a minute didn't somebody go out of their way to make an entire new post to say that the PS5 version might be the one in bad shape?

 

as illogical as it would have seemed to post video of a game two weeks before its official release, knowing that many games are patched at launch, and therefore pre-release video is usually not the most accurate indicator?

 

They did?  That thread sounds like it deserves a bump. 

[jehurey 3,228]

People need to be very concerned if this is a sign of major next-gen game development not being easy to transfer over the PC.

 

Its obvious that developers have clearly have had a mentality of "who cares for PC optimization, the people who really care will have high-end CPUs and Video Cards, and they can just run the game smoothly on brute force." For years.

 

That may not work anymore with games in which you are layering all of these effects and really using up alot of bandwidth because they're loading in super-high quality models and environments.

[Remij 4,670]

41 minutes ago, Goukosan said:

 

PC version should have been delayed. 

Canceled maybe.

[Remij 4,670]

25 minutes ago, jehurey said:

People need to be very concerned if this is a sign of major next-gen game development not being easy to transfer over the PC.

 

Its obvious that developers have clearly have had a mentality of "who cares for PC optimization, the people who really care will have high-end CPUs and Video Cards, and they can just run the game smoothly on brute force." For years.

 

That may not work anymore with games in which you are layering all of these effects and really using up alot of bandwidth because they're loading in super-high quality models and environments.

It's really not that.  It's 100% to do with exactly how the engine compiles shaders.

 

But yes, people should be very concerned if devs won't precompile them.

[Goukosan 2,250]

6 minutes ago, Remij said:

It's really not that.  It's 100% to do with exactly how the engine compiles shaders.

 

But yes, people should be very concerned if devs won't precompile them.

 

Sony apparently sent over some engineers to assist with optimization for the PS5 version.

 

If UE5 also has these shader compiler issues then it's going to bw a rough gen for hermits. 

[kaz 2,439]

 

Remij right now

[Hot Sauce 2,729]

1 hour ago, Goukosan said:

If UE5 also has these shader compiler issues then it's going to bw a rough gen for hermits. 

 

That was a pretty big design goal for UE 5.1

 

Quote

DX12 PSO Compilation Improvements

 

UE 5.1 aims to reduce stalls caused by shader compilation by starting to compile PSOs earlier, when components are loaded, rather than at the point where the object is rendered. This reduces or eliminates the need to manually gather PSO caches, which is a time-consuming process and cannot guarantee perfect coverage.

 

It is still possible to experience stalls if an object has to be rendered immediately after it's loaded. For the case of background streaming of distant objects, we've added the option to skip rendering the mesh until the PSO is ready, which trades stalls for delays in drawing these objects. Similarly, if a title needs to teleport the camera to a completely new location, or otherwise needs to display many new materials at once, there won't be enough time to compile all the PSOs. In this case, the game code needs to load the materials and meshes earlier, and hint the renderer ahead of time that it will need to draw them.

 

The existing PSO cache system can still work alongside the new system. It's possible to devise hybrid approaches, where there's a small, manually generated PSO cache containing materials which are known to be needed all the time, or are going to be used after a teleport event, and let the automatic system take care of most of the other materials.

 

This system is still under development and its performance will improve in future engine releases. It will also be expanded to support other RHIs, such as Vulkan.

 

[Quad Damage 1,725]

5 hours ago, Team 2019 said:

 

 

@ghostz@Remij

[jehurey 3,228]

2 hours ago, Remij said:

It's really not that.  It's 100% to do with exactly how the engine compiles shaders.

 

But yes, people should be very concerned if devs won't precompile them.

Dude, why have you not explained this before?

 

 

They CAN'T do it the way you are describing.

 

Its simply not an issue of "well, if the developers just do [blank]......."

 

They can't do it because of the nature of developing for PC.

There's no target spec to optimize.

 

And they're not going to optimize for dozens, potentially hundreds of different spec combinations.

 

You have no choice but to compile shaders upon your first playthrough.

[Remij 4,670]

33 minutes ago, jehurey said:

Dude, why have you not explained this before?

 

 

They CAN'T do it the way you are describing.

 

Its simply not an issue of "well, if the developers just do [blank]......."

 

They can't do it because of the nature of developing for PC.

There's no target spec to optimize.

 

And they're not going to optimize for dozens, potentially hundreds of different spec combinations.

 

You have no choice but to compile shaders upon your first playthrough.

Ok, I'm going to attempt to explain it to you exactly once.  Whether you listen, or become a complete idiot, is up to you.

 

Yes, they absolutely can do what I'm describing.... because developers ALREADY DO IT.  That poster in that post is talking about them compiling shaders and shipping them precompiled on the disk..  OBVIOUSLY THEY CANT DO THAT for every configuration out there.  That's not what I'm saying AT ALL.  Unreal Engine has a PSO caching system to cache which pipeline states are required for each shader/material..  It requires the developers to play through their game a bunch, gather the PSO data, recompile the build with the PSO data, and then play through it again, and repeat that process until a full cache is built.  That builds a PSO table which basically maps every shader/material to a PSO.  This allows the developers to pre-compile the shaders required ahead of time because they already know the pipeline state required.  This process by default automatically happens in Unreal Engine.... The problem is that you have to ENABLE the game to cache PSO data, and many developers simply don't know about it (because a lot of unreal engine developers are actually just artists) and/or they forget the process of rebuilding the game, to integrate the gathered PSO data.

 

So then with that PSO data included with the game.... our own computers can then precompile the shaders for our specific systems.

 

 

 

Edited December 2, 2022 by Remij

[lynux3 2,054]

PosC

[Remij 4,670]

2 hours ago, Goukosan said:

 

Sony apparently sent over some engineers to assist with optimization for the PS5 version.

 

If UE5 also has these shader compiler issues then it's going to bw a rough gen for hermits. 

And that's the thing.. it doesn't have to be.  Unreal Engine completely already has a system built in to deal with this.  It simply requires the developers to play the fuck out of their game, and build a PSO cache, and then include that cache with the game, so that we can pre-compile the shaders at launch ahead of time.

 

That's why I post shit like "I'm tired of it" in tweets.  Because it's completely not necessary. 

 

UE5.1 aims to also implement a system where the game will kick up some background threads and will begin precompiling shaders when the assets are first loaded into memory, and not right as the drawcall is made, like right now.

[jehurey 3,228]

27 minutes ago, Remij said:

Ok, I'm going to attempt to explain it to you exactly once.  Whether you listen, or become a complete idiot, is up to you.

 

Yes, they absolutely can do what I'm describing.... because developers ALREADY DO IT.  That poster in that post is talking about them compiling shaders and shipping them precompiled on the disk..

 

 

 

for console

 

which

 

has

 

only

 

one

 

hardware

 

spec

 

Did you listen to what I specifically typed.

 

I even highlighted it in red.

[Remij 4,670]

5 minutes ago, jehurey said:

for console

 

which

 

has

 

only

 

one

 

hardware

 

spec

 

Did you listen to what I specifically typed.

 

I even highlighted it in red.

Read what I said again.  

[bhytre 2,753]

Just watched a few minutes of a stream and it looks so generic, dated and clunky. Literally like a poverty Dead Space powered by Nintendo  

 

[jehurey 3,228]

25 minutes ago, Remij said:

Read what I said again.  

sweetie, its not some "switch" that the developer forgot to turn on in Unreal Engine

 

How incredibly naive do you have to be to believe that at this point?

 

Not to mention that it all goes out the window the moment new nVidia and AMD drivers are released.

 

You are the one that is not understanding this, and you have some incredibly misguided thinking on what you think the developers can do.

[-GD-X★ 7,731]

14 minutes ago, bhytre said:

Just watched a few minutes of a stream and it looks so generic, dated and clunky. Literally like a poverty Dead Space powered by Nintendo  

 

nah, it's pretty damn impressive on a technical level. however, i agree that it's very generic. a lot of the environments look so damn similar. that was fine in the mid 2000s (doom 3/f.e.a.r/dead space). however, 12-15 hours of repetitive environments now = eh.

[Remij 4,670]

7 minutes ago, jehurey said:

sweetie, its not some "switch" that the developer forgot to turn on in Unreal Engine

 

How incredibly naive do you have to be to believe that at this point?

 

Not to mention that it all goes out the window the moment new nVidia and AMD drivers are released.

 

You are the one that is not understanding this, and you have some incredibly misguided thinking on what you think the developers can do.

It's literally a switch they forgot to turn on

 

Configuring Your Project to Generate PSO Information

This section walks you through the changes you will need to make to your project settings to support PSO caches.

1. In the Unreal Editor, open Project Settings and navigate to the Project > Packaging section. Enable both Share Material Shader Code and Share Material Native Libraries, then restart the editor to ensure these settings take effect.

 

 

 

Dude... you have NO idea what you're talking about.

Edited December 2, 2022 by Remij

[Remij 4,670]

Sackboy was the same shit.

 

 

Look at the stutters on the PC on the right side. 

 

Guess what the developers did... in less than 1 week after Digital Foundry put that video up, the developers completely fixed it.  I own the game, and can confirm it's perfectly smooth the first time, and every time.

 

How did they do that?  

 

They played their game, generated a PSO cache, and then made the game precompile them all right at startup.