Sony Interactive Entertainment is developing a new kind of game cartridge

[Goukosan 2,339]

13 minutes ago, lynux3 said:

My biggest problem with digital is if these games are going to be preserved or obtainable in the future when licensing agreements expire or a studio goes defunct. Physical media is very important for those reasons, IMO. It's a shame that licensing is such a cluster fuck that no one has figured out a way around it yet for digital goods.

I agree.... digital is still a mess. 

[Remij 4,832]

1 hour ago, lynux3 said:

My biggest problem with digital is if these games are going to be preserved or obtainable in the future when licensing agreements expire or a studio goes defunct. Physical media is very important for those reasons, IMO. It's a shame that licensing is such a cluster fuck that no one has figured out a way around it yet for digital goods.

Physical media is still (can be) restricted by DRM...  Buying physical doesn't mean SHIT anymore....  People really need to get over the plastic shit man..  

 

They can just as easily make your disc not work as they can remove the game from the store...

[lynux3 2,247]

Just now, Remij_ said:

Physical media is still (can be) restricted by DRM...  Buying physical doesn't mean SHIT anymore....  People really need to get over the plastic shit man..  

 

DRM can be easily defeated while still preserving the content.

[Remij 4,832]

6 minutes ago, lynux3 said:

 

DRM can be easily defeated while still preserving the content.

Not when that content on the disc requires separate files not located on the disc to begin with... then you require a connection...

 

You might laugh at that... but that's where it's going..  Hell, even Spyro doesn't include the full game on the god damn disc.

 

And anyway, you're acting like physical is somehow superior to digital because they can remove digital... except everything digital has already been copied and preserved by someone whether they are cracked yet or not... and it's just as easy to break that DRM as it would be on Physical.  Easier actually.

 

Physical media also deteriorates...   Digital is inevitably the only way to TRULY preserve content.

[lynux3 2,247]

2 minutes ago, Remij_ said:

Not when that content on the disc requires separate files not located on the disc to begin with... then you require a connection...

 

You might laugh at that... but that's where it's going..  Hell, even Spyro doesn't include the full game on the god damn disc.

 

And anyway, you're acting like physical is somehow superior to digital because they can remove digital... except everything digital has already been copied and preserved by someone whether they are cracked yet or not... and it's just as easy to break that DRM as it would be on Physical.  Easier actually.

 

Physical media also deteriorates...   Digital is inevitably the only way to TRULY preserve content.

I think you missed my entire point.

 

"M y biggest problem with digit al is if these games are  going to be preserved o r obt ainable in the future when licensing  agreements exp ire or a studio goes defunct"

 

Physical media does deteriorate over time, but it can also be ripped and stored. The reality is that a PlayStation 1 CD is not going to deteriorate within my lifetime so that's a moot argument.

[lynux3 2,247]

We've seen more and more games being removed from digital stores (like Forza Horizon) due to licensing issues or some other reason. If the game didn't release physically someone who'd want to go back to the beginning of the series would be screwed until Microsoft fixes the issue despite it being readily available for download on their content servers.

[Remij 4,832]

2 minutes ago, lynux3 said:

I think you missed my entire point.

 

"M y biggest problem with digit al is if these games are  going to be preserved o r obt ainable in the future when licensing  agreements exp ire or a studio goes defunct"

 

Physical media does deteriorate over time, but it can also be ripped and stored. The reality is that a PlayStation 1 CD is not going to deteriorate within my lifetime so that's a moot argument.

So you're just worried about it for your own personal backlog reasons?  lmao.. ok fine.  I'm thinking more of the preservation of the actual history of gaming.  This stuff doesn't deserve to die on the hardware it was originally made for.  Which is why I love emulation and root for it.

 

On PC... everything is cracked and preserved so that if in the future something were to happen, we'd be easily able to download and play the games regardless of what happened.  That's why we don't care about physical media... like who fucking cares?  Oh no... x game was taken off Steam because of licensing issues... Ok.. I'll just download the cracked version.  

 

I get what you're saying, and you're mostly speaking with regards to consoles and console games... but physical in the future is going to require an online component anyway.. a digital check... plus missing content.  They'll have the ability to deactivate every copy of a game or parts of it after a license expires or whatever.  Your ability to "make a copy of the disc" doesn't and wont change that. 

 

Every PS4 game I bet has already been ripped and uploaded or stored somewhere.  I'm not worried about Sony "taking stuff away" just as I'm not worried about Valve taking stuff away.   I'd care... if physical versions of games were godly like they were in the past and you felt like you were actually getting something nice.  But a plastic disc and pamphlet telling me the address that I can read the manual at is garbo.

 

Just give me digital.. and if they start mass removing games... the internet shall rise together to hit them where it hurts the most. lmao

[lynux3 2,247]

32 minutes ago, Remij_ said:

So you're just worried about it for your own personal backlog reasons? 

[Twinblade★ 4,068]

If they get rid of the blu ray drive for this then I don't think i would like this decision.

Edited November 27, 2018 by Twinblade

[Remij 4,832]

18 minutes ago, lynux3 said:

Yea, you're worried that Sony's gonna take away your games and that you wont be able to re-download them because of licensing... Or your worried that games you haven't bought yet will be removed before you can buy them... years later...  

[lynux3 2,247]

4 minutes ago, Remij_ said:

Yea, you're worried that Sony's gonna take away your games and that you wont be able to re-download them because of licensing...   

Where did I say anything specifically about Sony? I even gave a specific example which went right over your head. You alright, dude? Your RTX must in the OFF position.

Edited November 28, 2018 by lynux3

[Remij 4,832]

5 minutes ago, lynux3 said:

Where did I say anything specifically about Sony? I even gave a specific example which went right over your head. You alright, dude? Your RTX must in the OFF position.

 

1 hour ago, lynux3 said:

I think you missed my entire point.

 

"M y biggest problem with digit al is if these games are  going to be preserved o r obt ainable in the future when licensing  agreements exp ire or a studio goes defunct"

 

Physical media does deteriorate over time, but it can also be ripped and stored. The reality is that a PlayStation 1 CD is not going to deteriorate within my lifetime so that's a moot argument.

 

 

And it doesn't even matter... I used Sony as an example... it could be any console manufacturer... 

 

 

And you said my RTX was in the "off" position... wouldn't that be a good thing?  

[lynux3 2,247]

2 minutes ago, Remij_ said:

 

 

 

And it doesn't even matter... I used Sony as an example... it could be any console manufacturer... 

 

 

And you said my RTX was in the "off" position... wouldn't that be a good thing?  

I only said the PS CD thing because you said physical media deteriorates. Anyways, yeah, this is about access to content that was previously accessible to it no longer being accessible. Outside of piracy or defeating DRM, how is someone suppose to consume said content that missed out on its availability window?

[Remij 4,832]

Just now, lynux3 said:

I only said the PS CD thing because you said physical media deteriorates. Anyways, yeah, this is about access to content that was previously accessible to it no longer being accessible. Outside of piracy or defeating DRM, how is someone suppose to consume said content that missed out on its availability window?

Realistically they shouldn't.  Once it's gone.. it should be gone...  We don't have the right to demand that something is always available for sale.  I know that with physical media, even if they stop producing it, you could still buy used copies and those can be made into more copies.  But really I think it's the same thing with digital, man.  I don't think it's unique to just physical copies.  Even if there's no physical copies made of something, someone will always be copying and archiving the content, even if they aren't cracked or whatever... for the future.

 

I fucking hate the fact that games have licenses in place where after a certain amount of time, or because of some music track or whatever, that they can no longer be sold.  I think Publishers and developers have to figure that shit out so that it doesn't happen... or at least as little as possible.   In my opinion, once a game has been put up for sale... and then removed years later and no longer for sale anywhere... well then that's prime time to pirate.  Games that are no longer commercially available for download (and don't have physical copies) means that they don't stand to gain or lose anything at that point.

 

Anyway, that's a more personal problem of "will I be able to buy" rather than a "gaming history" problem which is what I was saying that for me is more important.  Imagine a future where nobody could play these physical games lying around because no consoles are working that can play them?  

 

All I was trying to say was that if they want.. and I'm sure it will be so in the future... that physical games will be no better than digital copies and they'd be able to deactivate copies and make them impossible to play in the future.. meaning that we're really no better off. 

[lynux3 2,247]

8 minutes ago, Remij_ said:

Realistically they shouldn't.  Once it's gone.. it should be gone...  We don't have the right to demand that something is always available for sale.  I know that with physical media, even if they stop producing it, you could still buy used copies and those can be made into more copies.  But really I think it's the same thing with digital, man.  I don't think it's unique to just physical copies.  Even if there's no physical copies made of something, someone will always be copying and archiving the content, even if they aren't cracked or whatever... for the future.

 

I fucking hate the fact that games have licenses in place where after a certain amount of time, or because of some music track or whatever, that they can no longer be sold.  I think Publishers and developers have to figure that shit out so that it doesn't happen... or at least as little as possible.   In my opinion, once a game has been put up for sale... and then removed years later and no longer for sale anywhere... well then that's prime time to pirate.  Games that are no longer commercially available for download (and don't have physical copies) means that they don't stand to gain or lose anything at that point.

 

Anyway, that's a more personal problem of "will I be able to buy" rather than a "gaming history" problem which is what I was saying that for me is more important.  Imagine a future where nobody could play these physical games lying around because no consoles are working that can play them?  

 

All I was trying to say was that if they want.. and I'm sure it will be so in the future... that physical games will be no better than digital copies and they'd be able to deactivate copies and make them impossible to play in the future.. meaning that we're really no better off. 

Like you mentioned earlier, things like Spyro pretty much render the physical copy useless... it doesn't include the entire game. I think at the very least if you're going to release physical based copy you should include the entire single player experience and obviously anything multiplayer or GaaS based content will forever be fucked. Something like Destiny for sure just isn't going to happen... it's either you experience it during its time or you don't ever.

 

But yeah, it is definitely geared towards a personal issue towards physical vs. digital. I have no doubt that the games themselves will be preserved forever in some form or fashion. It's not like publishers or distributors don't have the copy of the game, it's just that they don't have the rights anymore to sell/distribute it.

Edited November 28, 2018 by lynux3