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SheepKilla

Obamagate megathread - Worst political scandal in US history

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5 minutes ago, SheepKilla said:

 It's a complex story but they got caught red-handed. 

 

1) Election is going on. Obama's CIA and FBI are spying on Trump and others via a system which processes requests. These requests are automatic but a record is logged when made. Espionage started well before a candidate was picked for either side, though. 

 

2) Whistle-blower (Mike Rogers) sees the records and says something is wrong, raises alarm. He has no idea at this point what's going on, just that something is weird. 

 

3) At this point access is cut off so they go to plan B. They need to craft a narrative to keep spying, because you can't just randomly spy on a US citizen. Money that was ultimately traced to Clinton foundation paid for the Steele dossier. This is where the Russia stuff came from: this document. Steele dossier is 100% fake, and a simple reading of it exposes it. It reads like fiction. But they didn't care, because they thought document would never see public eyes. 

 

4) They start using Dossier as their evidence to keep up the spying in the secret FISA court, for warrants, even though it's a fake document...created just for the purpose to start the spying again through different channels (warrants). 
 

5) Trump ends up winning election, and he would have access to the story of what was going on. At this point they only have one choice: Double-down on Russia narrative, and accuse him of being connected to Kremlin. But this time they must bring it into the public light (because they're forced to) rather than a secret court. Originally it was just supposed to be an excuse that nobody read and then swept under the rug after Hillary won. 

 

6) Russia narrative starts hitting airwaves to cover up what was really going on and mask it. At this point Trump can't start his own investigation, because that makes him look bad, as if he's conspiring to "silence" his opponents who accused him. And plus, they hope someone wil somehow slip up and actually feed the narrative something (Even though all attempts completely failed). 

 

7) 3 years of investigation, and nothing is found related to the original claims. Testimony reveals all officials under oath denying any actual direct evidence, including Clapper and Susan Rice.    

 

8) Spies, honeypots, and actual Russian agents were involved during the whole thing and the story is even more complex and scandalous than that.

 

9) An investigation into the investigation was opened up about 6 months ago. News reports said it became a criminal investigation a few months ago. 

Wow. This makes watergate look lame in comparison. 

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2 minutes ago, SheepKilla said:

 It's a complex story but they got caught red-handed. 

 

1) Election is going on. Obama's CIA and FBI are spying on Trump and others via a system which processes requests. These requests are automatic but a record is logged when made. Espionage started well before a candidate was picked for either side, though. 

 

 

No, they are not spying.

 

In fact the FBI is tipped off about George Papadapolous from an Australian Prime Minister diplomat.

 

None of this comes from Obama.

 

Carter Page has been under the CIA's eye since 2013.

4 minutes ago, SheepKilla said:

2) Whistle-blower (Mike Rogers) sees the records and says something is wrong, raises alarm. He has no idea at this point what's going on, just that something is weird. 

 

Post proof please.

 

What is it that he determines "is wrong"?

 

Please post articles from actual credible sources.

 

Is this person a politician, or a "contributor" for a tv news show?

 

6 minutes ago, SheepKilla said:

 

3) At this point access is cut off so they go to plan B. They need to craft a narrative to keep spying, because you can't just randomly spy on a US citizen. Money that was ultimately traced to Clinton foundation paid for the Steele dossier. This is where the Russia stuff came from: this document. Steele dossier is 100% fake, and a simple reading of it exposes it. It reads like fiction. But they didn't care, because they thought document would never see public eyes. 

 

No. there is no "cut off" in fact, two separate things have started individually on their own.

 

George Papadapolous is now having an investigation on him begin in March 2016.

 

The Steele Dossier originally began work from REPUBLICAN campaigns paying for Fusion GPS to dig up info on Trump.

 

Why are omitting that information, that this started from Republican campaign money?

 

Stelle Dossier is not fake. In fact alot of people have said that alot of information that the Steele Dossier has claimed has been corroborated.

 

Here what has been corroborated:

  • Trump's campaign having direct contact with Russia: "in the two years since those denials were issued, news reports and court filings revealed that at least 16 Trump associates had contacts with Russians during the campaign or transition. "
  • Russia meddling in the 2016, verified by our own US Intelligence agencies.
  • Trump doing real estate dealings in Russia. We didn't find out about Trump Tower Moscow until 2018.
  • Russian leverage on Trump: Trump Tower Moscow being kept hidden, and Michael Cohen lying about it when questioned by Congress effectively means that Moscow has kompramat against Trump, since they are hiding the fact that they had a real estate dealing and saying the opposite.
  • Michael Cohen's trip to Prague: They denied it and denied it and denied it............and then Michael Cohen admitted to it.
  • Michael Flynn was paid directly by Russia for his trip in 2015: Flynn denied it during the campaign, and it turned out to be true. Russia did pay him, and he was trying to hide it.
  • Carter Page's multiple meetings with Russians: 
    "Page traveled to Russia in July 2016 for what he said was a personal trip. Steele wrote that Page met the president of Rosneft, a state-run oil company, and discussed a potential deal for Trump to lift US sanctions in exchange for future energy cooperation between the two countries. Steele's intelligence on Page's visit also includes sources claiming the Russians raised the prospect of political dirt with Page, dirt they had on both Clinton and Trump.
    No public evidence has emerged to support these allegations, and Page has denied meeting with the president of Rosneft in dozens of interviews. But under questioning by the House Intelligence Committee behind closed doors, Page admitted that he met a different official from Rosneft during the trip."
No.........you're quite wrong. The Steele Dossier is one of the most successful pieces of intelligence ever compiled in recent memory. Many security experts and former National Security experts have said as much.
 
 
20 minutes ago, SheepKilla said:

 

4) They start using Dossier as their evidence to keep up the spying in the secret FISA court, for warrants, even though it's a fake document...created just for the purpose to start the spying again through different channels (warrants). 
 

 

Nope the Steele Dossier was NEVER used to get FISA warrants through the FISA court.

 

Steele Dossier was not even provided to the FBI until September 2016. Investigations were already started because of Papadapolous. The FBI has been started as of July 2016.

 

You're not just wrong..........but completely impossible due to the dates simply not lining up.

 

 

25 minutes ago, SheepKilla said:

 
 

5) Trump ends up winning election, and he would have access to the story of what was going on. At this point they only have one choice: Double-down on Russia narrative, and accuse him of being connected to Kremlin. But this time they must bring it into the public light (because they're forced to) rather than a secret court. Originally it was just supposed to be an excuse that nobody read and then swept under the rug after Hillary won. 

 

 

You're not saying anything here..................this sounds like fan-fiction/speculation.

 

The investigation IS on-going, no matter what. And the investigation is on the "Trump Campaign"

 

Not Trump the person, they are following the initial lead, and it is leading them to other members of the Trump campaign. Specifically people like Paul Manafort.

 

27 minutes ago, SheepKilla said:

 

 

6) Russia narrative starts hitting airwaves to cover up what was really going on and mask it. At this point Trump can't start his own investigation, because that makes him look bad, as if he's conspiring to "silence" his opponents who accused him. And plus, they hope someone wil somehow slip up and actually feed the narrative something (Even though all attempts completely failed). 

 

 

No, what makes Trump look bad is his repeated attempts to STOP the investigation.

 

Most notably firing John Comey, and clearly admitting to Russian diplomats that he fired him in order to "get this Russia-Trump" thing off of him.

 

If anything the investigation grows wider in scope because Trump is repeatedly trying to stop it and trying to cover up his lies, and trying to cover for the people who are trying to lie for him (Paul Manafort, Michael Flynn).

 

"I hope you can let this Michael Flynn thing go" he said to Comey. That's obstruction of justice.

 

And the Mueller report found at least 10 instances from the Trump White House that would be construed as Obstruction of Justice.

 

31 minutes ago, SheepKilla said:

 

 

7) 3 years of investigation, and nothing is found related to the original claims. Testimony reveals all officials under oath denying any actual direct evidence, including Clapper and Susan Rice.    

 

8) Spies, honeypots, and actual Russian agents were involved during the whole thing and the story is even more complex and scandalous than that.

 

9) An investigation into the investigation was opened up about 6 months ago. News reports said it became a criminal investigation a few months ago. 

No, like I mentioned the Mueller Report found several instances of Obstruction of Justice.............and he COULD NOT FIND HIM INNOCENT of the first charge, that being if he was colluding with Russia.

 

he said he couldn't find sufficient evidence of guilt.

 

he had the option of saying he found "no evidence" and therefore find him innocent.............but Mueller didn't say that, either.

 

And your other points are basically you just babbling and not really anything.

 

 

 

Notice how I provide SO MUCH MORE INFORMATION and HARD DETAILS than you?

 

Let me know when you have responses to those.

 

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25 minutes ago, jehurey said:

No, they are not spying.

 

In fact the FBI is tipped off about George Papadapolous from an Australian Prime Minister diplomat.

 

None of this comes from Obama.

  

 Carter Page has been under the CIA's eye since 2013.

Carter Page was under the CIA's eye...because he directly WORKED for them! The fact you don't know this is complete ignorance, and you have the nerve to try to correct me. LMAO

 

George Papadapolous was simply a dupe, no more no less. Did absolutely nothing wrong. Even wrote a nice book recently called Deep State Target: How I Got Caught in the Crosshairs of the Plot to Bring Down President Trump. They were tracking him so they could enter the campaign. If Papadapolous is linked to foreign agents, there is a loophole in the law that lets them investigate him without his rights as a US citizen. Because this allows a Counter-Espionage investigation to start where normal rules of law don't apply, especially ones on surveillance. 

 

1 hour ago, jehurey said:

Post proof please.

 

What is it that he determines "is wrong"?

 Please post articles from actual credible sources.

  

Is this person a politician, or a "contributor" for a tv news show?

 

He was involved with the NSA:

"In 2016, Rogers helped expose FISA flaws of a different kind by the NSA and the FBI. That October, as the bureau received its first Page surveillance warrant, Rogers notified the FISA Court of an NSA inspector general report that found the agency was pulling data directly from the internet and improperly searching it for information related to Americans in violation of FISA laws dealing with foreigners outside the United States targeted by U.S. intelligence agencies."

 

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/john-durham-interviewing-former-nsa-leader-who-told-court-about-other-fisa-abuses

 

In other words, there are complex LAWS at play when any American citizen - let alone a president elect - is spied on. These people were not following the laws.

 

 

1 hour ago, jehurey said:

No. there is no "cut off" in fact, two separate things have started individually on their own.

  

George Papadapolous is now having an investigation on him begin in March 2016.

 

The Steele Dossier originally began work from REPUBLICAN campaigns paying for Fusion GPS to dig up info on Trump.

 

Why are omitting that information, that this started from Republican campaign money?

 

Stelle Dossier is not fake. In fact alot of people have said that alot of information that the Steele Dossier has claimed has been corroborated.

 

Here what has been corroborated:

 Trump's campaign having direct contact with Russia: "in the two years since those denials were issued, news reports and court filings revealed that at least 16 Trump associates had contacts with Russians during the campaign or transition. "
Russia meddling in the 2016, verified by our own US Intelligence agencies.
Trump doing real estate dealings in Russia. We didn't find out about Trump Tower Moscow until 2018.
 Russian leverage on Trump: Trump Tower Moscow being kept hidden, and Michael Cohen lying about it when questioned by Congress effectively means that Moscow has kompramat against Trump, since they are hiding the fact that they had a real estate dealing and saying the opposite.
 Michael Cohen's trip to Prague: They denied it and denied it and denied it............and then Michael Cohen admitted to it.
 Michael Flynn was paid directly by Russia for his trip in 2015: Flynn denied it during the campaign, and it turned out to be true. Russia did pay him, and he was trying to hide it.
Carter Page's multiple meetings with Russians: 
"Page traveled to Russia in July 2016 for what he said was a personal trip. Steele wrote that Page met the president of Rosneft, a state-run oil company, and discussed a potential deal for Trump to lift US sanctions in exchange for future energy cooperation between the two countries. Steele's intelligence on Page's visit also includes sources claiming the Russians raised the prospect of political dirt with Page, dirt they had on both Clinton and Trump.
 No public evidence has emerged to support these allegations, and Page has denied meeting with the president of Rosneft in dozens of interviews. But under questioning by the House Intelligence Committee behind closed doors, Page admitted that he met a different official from Rosneft during the trip."
 No.........you're quite wrong. The Steele Dossier is one of the most successful pieces of intelligence ever compiled in recent memory. Many security experts and former National Security experts have said as much.

 

Steele dossier is fake. Of course it has a sentence or two that is true. Just like how I could write a fan fiction and then get 10% correct simply because I wrote it. I just need to quote it to prove its fake overall, though. You must have never read it and got your news second-hand from CNN:

 

"So far TRUMP has declined various sweetener real estate business deals offered him in Russia in order to further the Kremlin's cultivation of him. However he and his inner circle have accepted a regular flow of intelligence from the Kremlin, including on his Democratic and other political rivals"

 

"The Kremlin's cultivation operation on TRUMP also had comprised offering him various lucrative real estate development business deals in Russia, especially in relation to the ongoing 2018 World Cup soccer tournament. However, so far, for reasons unknown, TRUMP had not taken up any of these."- They claim to know the incredibly specific claim that Trump has rejected "sweetener real estate business details" from Russia, but somehow they have no idea why.

 

"However, there were other aspects to TRUMP's engagement with the Russian authorities. One which had borne fruit for them was to exploit personal obsessions and sexual perversion in order to obtain suitable 'kompromat' [compromising material] on him. According to Source D, where s/he had been present, (perverted) conduct in Moscow included hiring the presidential suite of the Ritz Carlton Hotel, where he knew President and OBAMA [whom he hated] had stayed on one of their official trips to Russia, and defiling the bed where they had slept by employing a number of prostitutes to perform a 'golden showers'(urination) show in front of him. The hotel was known to be under FSB control with microphones and concealed cameras in all the main rooms to record anything they wanted to." -Sexual fantasy involving Trump and Obama

 

"Speaking to a compatriot and friend on 19 October 2016, a Kremlin insider provided further details of reported clandestine meeting/s between Republican presidential candidate, Donald TRUMP's lawyer Michael COHEN and Kremlin representatives in August 2016. Although the communication between them had to be cryptic for security reasons, the Kremlin insider clearly indicated to his/her friend that the reported contact/s took place in Prague, Czech Republic." - Robert Mueller admitted there was no evidence Cohen ever went to Prague. Cohen also said under oath he never went there. Wouldn't it be easy to uncover this simple fact? He said he never even stepped FOOT inside Prague, let alone went there to meet people.

 

"Continuing on this theme, the senior leadership figure commented that a stream of further hacked CLINTON material already had been injected by the Kremlin into compliant western media outlets like WlkiLeaks, which remained at least "plausibly deniable", so the stream of these would continue through October and up to the election However s/he understood that the best material the Russians had already was out and there were no real game-changers to come." -To this day, there was no real evidence Russia was behind the hack. It's completely unknown. Don't you think the FBI could figure out who hacked email servers by now? Something surely must not be adding up for you by this point of what you called "one of the most successful pieces of intelligence ever compiled in recent memory" ? 

 

"In Prague, COHEN agreed contingency plans for various scenarios to protect the operation, but in particular what was to be done in the event that Hillary CLINTON won the presidency. It was important in this event that all cash payments owed were made quickly and discreetly and that cyber and other operators were stood down/able to go effectively to ground to cover their traces." -They knew everything Cohen said, where he went, yet can't give any actual evidence except HEARSAY in a SECOND HAND account. This is COMPLETELY unverified.  

 

1 hour ago, jehurey said:

Nope the Steele Dossier was NEVER used to get FISA warrants through the FISA court.

 

Steele Dossier was not even provided to the FBI until September 2016. Investigations were already started because of Papadapolous. The FBI has been started as of July 2016.

 

You're not just wrong..........but completely impossible due to the dates simply not lining up

 

At this point you are either deliberately lying or so ignorant as to not be worth anyone's time here, LMAO. Even CBS (Fake news) confirmed it was used in FISA as evidence, easily found by a simple Google search:

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/footnotes-in-watchdog-report-indicate-fbi-knew-of-risk-of-russian-disinformation-in-the-steele-dossier/

 

 "The dossier was used, in part, by FBI investigators to secure four surveillance warrants for Page."

 

1 hour ago, jehurey said:

Steele Dossier was not even provided to the FBI until September 2016. Investigations were already started because of Papadapolous. The FBI has been started as of July 2016.

You're not just wrong..........but completely impossible due to the dates simply not lining up.

 

I never said Steele dossier started the spying. I said the Steele dossier was used to JUSTIFY more advanced spying. And it all lines up perfectly. Do you notice a pattern with all these dates? It's all...right BEFORE the 2016 election that took place on November 8. Again, they needed to enter the campaign somehow. They isolated Carter Page (horrible idea) and George Papadapolous (who didn't fall for the game) and tried to create something that wasn't there. They never thought it would have to go public. 

 

1 hour ago, jehurey said:

And the Mueller report found at least 10 instances from the Trump White House that would be construed as Obstruction of Justice.

 

Mueller clarified specifically that he never charged Trump with anything. Because he had nothing and knew it, and needed to at least throw something (Even if not an actual charge). Starting an investigation, coming up empty, and then charging for something that happened ONLY because of said baseless investigation, would cause mass riots across the country. 

 

 

  • aitch 2

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For years these traitors were spouting bullshit about Trump being a puppet and behind closed doors they admit its all bullshit. This is definitely a failed coup.

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2 hours ago, SheepKilla said:

Carter Page was under the CIA's eye...because he directly WORKED for them! The fact you don't know this is complete ignorance, and you have the nerve to try to correct me. LMAO

 

 

No, you're wrong.

 

And I'm to correct you right now.

 

Carter

Page

never

worked

for

the

CIA.

 

Ever. And you don't have proof.

 

Carter Page came under FBI surveillance in 2013, because they were bugging two Russian spies in the United States, and they were trying to find an American to use as a informant.

 

That is how the US intelligence community came across Carter Page............a genuine dimwit who actually is pro-Putin.


https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/02/03/carter-page-nunes-memo-216934

Quote

 

To answer that question meaningfully it is necessary to go back—to 2013, and to a group of jaded Putin spies working deep undercover in downtown Manhattan. One of them was Viktor Podobnyy. Moscow had dispatched Podobnyy to the United States under his own name. He worked in New York under official “cover”: attaché to Russia’s delegation to the United Nations.

 

In reality, Podobnyy was employed by Russia’s foreign intelligence service, the SVR. Putin was the former head of the SVR's domestic counterpart, the FSB. Podobnyy's mission was to recruit Americans and to collect economic intelligence. One of his SVR colleagues was Igor Sporyshev, who was working covertly as a “trade representative.” Neither man was aware that the FBI had a bug inside their SVR office. The Bureau was secretly listening to their conversations.

 

One of their tasks was to liaise with another SVR officer, Evgeny Buryakov. Buryakov's position was somewhat precarious. He didn’t have diplomatic immunity, which meant if he was caught he could go to jail. His official day job was at a branch of a Russian state bank in Manhattan, VEB.

 

As FBI wiretaps showed, the techniques for meeting with Buryakov were distinctly old-school. Typically, Sporyshev would ring Buryakov and tell him he had to give him “something”—a ticket, a book, a hat, an umbrella. The two would meet outdoors. This sometimes happened outside Buryakov’s bank office on Third Avenue—an inconspicuous brown tower with a 1960s abstract sculpture at street level opposite the foyer. They would exchange documents.

 

Sporyshev’s biggest headache was finding Americans willing to become intelligence sources for Russia. This was tough. He had approached two young women working in financial consultancy who had recently graduated from a New York university. Sporyshev told Podobnyy he was skeptical anything would come of it. Or, as he put it in chauvinist terms: “In order to be close you need to either fuck them or use other levers to execute my requests.”

 

The Russian spies, however, had one promising lead. This was a guy—an energy consultant based in New York City. Unlike the women, he was eager to help. And, it appeared, keen to make money in Moscow. There was a drawback: The source—whom the FBI called “Male-1”—was something of a dimwit.

 

The FBI intercepts record:

 

PODOBNYY: [Male-1] wrote that he is sorry, he went to Moscow and forgot to check his inbox, but he wants to meet when he gets back. I think he is an idiot and forgot who I am. Plus he writes to me in Russian [to] practise the language. He flies to Moscow more often than I do. He got hooked on [the Russian state energy company] Gazprom, thinking that if they have a project, he could rise up. Maybe he can. I don’t know, but it’s obvious he wants to earn loads of money.

 

SPORYSHEV: Without a doubt.

 

Podobnyy explained he intended to string Male-1 along. That meant feeding him “empty promises.” Podobnyy would play up his connections to Russia’s trade delegation, to Sporyshev, and pretend his SVR colleague might “push contracts” the American’s way.

 

PODOBNYY: This is intelligence method to cheat! How else to work with foreigners? You promise a favour for a favour. You get the documents from him and go tell him to fuck himself. But not to upset you I will take you to a restaurant and give you an expensive gift. You just need to sign for it. That is ideal working method.

 

These tactics may have been crude. In this instance they worked. Podobnyy approached the consultant at an energy symposium in New York. According to FBI court documents, the two swapped contacts. They emailed for several months. Male-1 co-operated, although he says he did not know the Russian was a spy. He even handed him documents about the energy world.

 

This was a strange business—Kremlin officers careening around Manhattan, spycraft involving fake umbrellas, and an American intelligence source who spent more time in Moscow than his Russian handlers. Plus espionage professionals who turned out to be suffering from ennui.

 

The American willing to provide information to Putin’s foreign intelligence officers rented a working space at 590 Madison Avenue. The building was linked by a glass atrium to a well-known New York landmark, Trump Tower. The atrium had a pleasant courtyard, with bamboo trees, where you could sit and drink coffee. Next door was a franchise of Niketown.

 

From the atrium you could take the elevator up to the Trump Tower public garden on the fourth floor, with its sparrows and maple trees. The din from West 57th Street meant the garden wasn’t exactly tranquil. Or you could queue up with Japanese and German tourists at the Trump Tower basement restaurant and salad bar. Failing that, there was Starbucks on the first floor.

 

Male-1 had a name. At this point few had heard of him. He was Carter Page.

 

You are very wrong. And you don't have evidence to back up your claim.

 

You just lost this talking point. Easy.

 

2 hours ago, SheepKilla said:

George Papadapolous was simply a dupe, no more no less. Did absolutely nothing wrong. Even wrote a nice book recently called Deep State Target: How I Got Caught in the Crosshairs of the Plot to Bring Down President Trump. They were tracking him so they could enter the campaign. If Papadapolous is linked to foreign agents, there is a loophole in the law that lets them investigate him without his rights as a US citizen. Because this allows a Counter-Espionage investigation to start where normal rules of law don't apply, especially ones on surveillance. 

 

 

NNNNNNNNNNNNNnnnnnnope

 

George Papadapolous talked about Clinton's emails having been hacked and how Russian was going to meddle in the American election.

 

He's stupid..............but he divulged information that absolutely became true, and it was so worrying that an Australian diplomat was so concerned that they contacted the American FBI to tip them off.

 

And that is how the FBI start looking into him in May 2016, and that lead to the Trump campaign by July 2016

 

 

Quote

 

Papadopoulos brag to Australian diplomat was key factor in FBI's Russia probe: report

WASHINGTON — An Australian diplomat's tip appears to have helped persuade the FBI to investigate Russian meddling in the U.S. election and possible coordination with the Trump campaign, The New York Times reported Saturday.

 

Trump campaign adviser George Papadopoulos told the diplomat, Alexander Downer, during a meeting in London in May 2016 that Russia had thousands of emails that would embarrass Democratic candidate Hillary Clinton, the report said. Downer, a former foreign minister, is Australia's top diplomat in Britain.

 

Australia passed the information on to the FBI after the Democratic emails were leaked, according to The Times, which cited four current and former U.S. and foreign officials with direct knowledge of the Australians' role.

 

"The hacking and the revelation that a member of the Trump campaign may have had inside information about it were driving factors that led the FBI to open an investigation in July 2016," the newspaper said.

 

Papadopoulos has pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI and is a cooperating witness. Court documents unsealed two months ago show he met in April 2016 with Joseph Mifsud, a professor in London who told him about Russia's cache of emails. This was before the Democratic National Committee became aware of the scope of the intrusion into its email systems by hackers later linked to the Russian government.

The Times said Papadopoulos shared this information with Downer, but it was unclear whether he also shared it with anyone in the Trump campaign.

 

Yup, you lost this talking point as well.

 

I'm going and dismantle your other responded. Second post incoming.

 

Edited by jehurey

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2 hours ago, SheepKilla said:

He was involved with the NSA:

"In 2016, Rogers helped expose FISA flaws of a different kind by the NSA and the FBI. That October, as the bureau received its first Page surveillance warrant, Rogers notified the FISA Court of an NSA inspector general report that found the agency was pulling data directly from the internet and improperly searching it for information related to Americans in violation of FISA laws dealing with foreigners outside the United States targeted by U.S. intelligence agencies."

 

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/john-durham-interviewing-former-nsa-leader-who-told-court-about-other-fisa-abuses

 

In other words, there are complex LAWS at play when any American citizen - let alone a president elect - is spied on. These people were not following the laws.

 

 

 

Except Rogers only complained that they didn't do a good job with the sourcing.

 

He is not disputing the conclusions of the evidence..............and he WANTED THOSE FISA WARRANTS as well.

 

:lawl::lawl::lawl::lawl::lawl::lawl:

 

Rogers own words:

Quote

 

Rogers and Comey, along with Director of National Intelligence James Clapper and CIA Director John Brennan, who is being scrutinized by Durham, briefed President-elect Trump about their findings at Trump Tower. Comey stayed to tell Trump about some of the dossier's more salacious allegations.

 

The assessment concluded with "high confidence" that Russian President Vladimir Putin “ordered an influence campaign in 2016” and that Russia worked to “undermine public faith in the U.S. democratic process, denigrate former Secretary of State Clinton, and harm her electability and potential presidency” and “developed a clear preference for President-elect Trump.” The NSA diverged on one aspect, expressing only “moderate confidence” that Putin actively tried to help Trump’s election chances and harm those of Clinton by contrasting her unfavorably, and Durham is likely looking into whether Steele's dossier played a role in the determinations of the other agencies.

 

“I wouldn’t call it a discrepancy, I’d call it an honest difference of opinion between three different organizations and, in the end, I made that call,” Rogers told the Senate in May 2017. “It didn’t have the same level of sourcing and the same level of multiple sources.”

 

Rogers was a Russia hawk, however, telling the Senate in February 2018 about Russia’s plans of “stirring discord in the West” and how “this threatens the foundations of democracy.”

 

“More broadly, my concern is that President Putin has clearly come to the conclusion that there’s little price to pay here," Rogers said. "Clearly, what we have done is not enough.”

 

“I was glad to see the broad direction that we were moving in," Rogers said in a post-retirement interview last year. "But I'm not going to pretend for a minute it's perfect by any stretch of the imagination.”

 

Rogers agrees with the broad direction that the intelligence that had opened investigations into Russian meddling. And everything they had been doing up until his retirement in 2018.

 

That has been entirely based on investigation the Trump campaign. Correct? COooooooooooooooorrect.

 

He is actually supporting the idea that Russia was involved in the election.

 

2 hours ago, SheepKilla said:

Steele dossier is fake. Of course it has a sentence or two that is true. Just like how I could write a fan fiction and then get 10% correct simply because I wrote it. I just need to quote it to prove its fake overall, though. You must have never read it and got your news second-hand from CNN:

 

"So far TRUMP has declined various sweetener real estate business deals offered him in Russia in order to further the Kremlin's cultivation of him. However he and his inner circle have accepted a regular flow of intelligence from the Kremlin, including on his Democratic and other political rivals"

 

"The Kremlin's cultivation operation on TRUMP also had comprised offering him various lucrative real estate development business deals in Russia, especially in relation to the ongoing 2018 World Cup soccer tournament. However, so far, for reasons unknown, TRUMP had not taken up any of these."- They claim to know the incredibly specific claim that Trump has rejected "sweetener real estate business details" from Russia, but somehow they have no idea why.

 

"However, there were other aspects to TRUMP's engagement with the Russian authorities. One which had borne fruit for them was to exploit personal obsessions and sexual perversion in order to obtain suitable 'kompromat' [compromising material] on him. According to Source D, where s/he had been present, (perverted) conduct in Moscow included hiring the presidential suite of the Ritz Carlton Hotel, where he knew President and OBAMA [whom he hated] had stayed on one of their official trips to Russia, and defiling the bed where they had slept by employing a number of prostitutes to perform a 'golden showers'(urination) show in front of him. The hotel was known to be under FSB control with microphones and concealed cameras in all the main rooms to record anything they wanted to." -Sexual fantasy involving Trump and Obama

 

"Speaking to a compatriot and friend on 19 October 2016, a Kremlin insider provided further details of reported clandestine meeting/s between Republican presidential candidate, Donald TRUMP's lawyer Michael COHEN and Kremlin representatives in August 2016. Although the communication between them had to be cryptic for security reasons, the Kremlin insider clearly indicated to his/her friend that the reported contact/s took place in Prague, Czech Republic." - Robert Mueller admitted there was no evidence Cohen ever went to Prague. Cohen also said under oath he never went there. Wouldn't it be easy to uncover this simple fact? He said he never even stepped FOOT inside Prague, let alone went there to meet people.

 

"Continuing on this theme, the senior leadership figure commented that a stream of further hacked CLINTON material already had been injected by the Kremlin into compliant western media outlets like WlkiLeaks, which remained at least "plausibly deniable", so the stream of these would continue through October and up to the election However s/he understood that the best material the Russians had already was out and there were no real game-changers to come." -To this day, there was no real evidence Russia was behind the hack. It's completely unknown. Don't you think the FBI could figure out who hacked email servers by now? Something surely must not be adding up for you by this point of what you called "one of the most successful pieces of intelligence ever compiled in recent memory" ? 

 

"In Prague, COHEN agreed contingency plans for various scenarios to protect the operation, but in particular what was to be done in the event that Hillary CLINTON won the presidency. It was important in this event that all cash payments owed were made quickly and discreetly and that cyber and other operators were stood down/able to go effectively to ground to cover their traces." -They knew everything Cohen said, where he went, yet can't give any actual evidence except HEARSAY in a SECOND HAND account. This is COMPLETELY unverified.  

 

 

No it isn't fake.

 

And I love how your responses are weak and show no actual evidence...............you're just posting quotes./

 

Here..............let me give you direct evidence:

 

Trump Letter of Intent to build Trump Tower Moscow

 

Here

is

the

actual

letter

 

http://cdn.cnn.com/cnn/2018/images/12/18/attachment.1.pdf


There it is. The real estate deal that the Steele Dossier is saying that Trump was having dealings with Moscow.

 

Trump denied any such dealings through the campaign. Michael Cohen denied any such dealings. And Rudy Guliani denied any such dealings and any such letter.


There it is. In black and white. This was completely unknown during the entire campaign.

 

Which leads to the SECOND thing that the Steele Dossier gets correct:

Russia had kompromat on Trump.

 

This letter means that Russia is in possession of evidence that directly contradicts what Trump has been saying on the campaign trail.

 

That's kompromat, sweetie. Russia can release this letter during the campaign to hurt Trump, because it automatically becomes a scandal. That means Russia has leverage. National Security experts all agree that this is obvious kompromat.

 

Next one:

Michael Cohen went to Prague.

 

I don't need the Mueller report. We have the receipts:

 

 

 

Quote

 

December 27, 2018 12:20PM ET

Cell Phone Records Show Michael Cohen Was Near Prague When Alleged Meeting with Russia Took Place

Electronic eavesdropping also recorded a phone call between Russians discussing the Trump lawyer’s visit to the city

 

Michael Cohen’s cell phone pinged off cell phone towers in Prague during the summer of 2016, suggesting that Cohen was there meeting with Russian government officials as alleged in the infamous Steele dossier, McClatchy reported, citing four people familiar with the matter.

 

McClatchy also reported that electronic eavesdropping by an Eastern European intelligence agency picked up a call between Russians officials during which one said Cohen was in Prague. At the meeting, Cohen and Russians allegedly discussed how to hide the campaign’s close relationship with the Russian government. Both revelations have been shared with Robert Mueller, the special counsel investigating collusion between the Donald Trump presidential campaign and the Russian government.

 

Notice the date on the article, late December 2018, after many people tried to dispute the story earlier in April 2018.

 

Lastly:

 

Russia was behind the attack.

 

For starter.................YOUR BOY Rogers also says that Russia meddled in the elections.:lawl:

 

And we have an official report signed by all 17 US Intelligence Agencies, and conducted by the main 3 intelligence agencies that Russia was indeed meddling in elections and behind the Democratic National Party hack.

 

 

Quote

 

Apr 18 12:19p

Mueller report sheds new light on how the Russians hacked the DNC and the Clinton campaign

 

The Mueller report contains new information about how the Russian government hacked documents and emails from Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaign and the Democratic National Committee .

 

At one point, the Russians used servers located in the U.S. to carry out the massive data exfiltration effort, the report confirms.

 

Much of the information was previously learned from the indictment of Viktor Borisovich Netyksho, the Russian officer in charge of Unit 26165. Netyksho is believed to be still at large in Russia.

 

But new details in the 488-page redacted report released by the Justice Department on Thursday offered new insight into how the GRU operatives hacked.

 

The operatives working for the Russian intelligence directorate, the GRU, sent dozens of targeted spearphishing emails in just five days to the work and personal accounts of Clinton Campaign employees and volunteers, as a way to break into the campaign’s computer systems.

 

The GRU hackers also gained access to the email account of John Podesta, Clinton’s campaign chairman, of which its contents were later published.

 

Using credentials they stole along the way, the hackers broke into the networks of the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee days later. By stealing the login details of a system administrator who had “unrestricted access” to the network, the hackers broke into 29 computers in the ensuing weeks, and more than 30 computers on the DNC.

 

The operatives, known collectively as “Fancy Bear,” comprised several units tasked with specific operations. Mueller formally blamed Unit 26165, a division of the GRU specializing in targeting government and political organizations, for taking on the “primary responsibility for hacking the DCCC and DNC, as well as email accounts of individuals affiliated with the Clinton Campaign,” said the Mueller report.

 

The hackers used Mimikatz, a hacking tool used once an intruder is already in a target network, to collect credentials, and two other kinds of malware: X-Agent for taking screenshots and logging keystrokes, and X-Tunnel used to exfiltrate massive amounts of data from the network to servers controlled by the GRU. Mueller’s report found that Unit 26165 used several “middle servers” to act as a buffer between the hacked networks and the GRU’s main operations. Those servers, Mueller said, were hosted in Arizona — likely as a way to obfuscate where the attackers were located but also to avoid suspicion or detection.

 

In all, some 70 gigabytes of data were exfiltrated from Clinton’s campaign servers and some 300 gigabytes of data were obtained from the DNC’s network.

 

Meanwhile, another GRU hacking unit, Unit 74455, which helped disseminate and publish hacked and stolen documents, pushed the stolen data out through two fictitious personas. DCLeaks was a website that hosted the hacked material, while Guccifer 2.0 was a hacker-like figure who had a social presence and would engage with reporters.

 

Under pressure from the U.S. government, the two GRU-backed personas were shut down by the social media companies. Later, tens of thousands of hacked files were funneled to and distributed by WikiLeaks .

 

Mueller’s report also found a cause-and-effect between Trump’s remarks in July 2016 and subsequent cyberattacks.

 

“I hope you’re able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing,” said then-candidate Trump at a press conference, referring to emails Clinton stored on a personal email server while she headed the State Department. Mueller’s report said “within approximately five hours” of those remarks, GRU officers began targeting for the first time Clinton’s personal office.

 

More than a dozen staffers were targeted by Unit 26165, including a senior aide. “It is unclear how the GRU was able to identify these email accounts, which were not public,” said Mueller.

 

Mueller said the Trump campaign made efforts to “find the deleted Clinton emails.” Trump is said to have privately asked would-be national security advisor Michael Flynn, since convicted following inquiries by the Special Counsel’s office, to reach out to associates to obtain the emails. One of those associates was Peter Smith, who died by suicide in May 2017, who claimed to be in contact with Russian hackers — claims which Mueller said were not true.

 

[gasp]

 

Notice how the whole "conspiracy theory" logically fits??????????

 

You are most definitely going to lose this point, and will probably respond by posting incredible lame conspiracy theory responses with no hard evidence.

 

I await seeing you abandon pretending to sound intelligent and informed and go back to your old ways.

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This third post is to debunk your last three weak responses.

 

I can already tell that you were already losing it and getting angry by this point:

 

2 hours ago, SheepKilla said:

 

At this point you are either deliberately lying or so ignorant as to not be worth anyone's time here, LMAO. Even CBS (Fake news) confirmed it was used in FISA as evidence, easily found by a simple Google search:

 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/footnotes-in-watchdog-report-indicate-fbi-knew-of-risk-of-russian-disinformation-in-the-steele-dossier/

 

 "The dossier was used, in part, by FBI investigators to secure four surveillance warrants for Page."

 

 

You are talking about four FISA warrants on Carter Page that began in 2017.

 

I was talking about Carter Page was under FISA surveillance since 2014. Those warrants, which were being renewed every 3 months, were being done with no Steele Dossier.

 

Oh...........and those 4 warrants beginning 2017..........Inspector General's report found that the first two were perfectly valid, and that the latter two had flaws in the information gathering. But those warrants in 2018 would not have the Steele Dossier at the center of it, since the FBI would've been well underway with their investigation.

 

This really is a weak talking point, especially since the first FISA warrants were approved and proven to be perfectly valid, and the FBI isn't relying entirely on the Steele Dossier in 2018. LOL

 

3 hours ago, SheepKilla said:

 

I never said Steele dossier started the spying. I said the Steele dossier was used to JUSTIFY more advanced spying. And it all lines up perfectly. Do you notice a pattern with all these dates? It's all...right BEFORE the 2016 election that took place on November 8. Again, they needed to enter the campaign somehow. They isolated Carter Page (horrible idea) and George Papadapolous (who didn't fall for the game) and tried to create something that wasn't there. They never thought it would have to go public. 

 

 

 

 

No it wasn't.

 

George Papadapolous started the FBI investigation

 

July 2016, sweetie.................that's when the FBI opened the case on the Trump campaign.

 

Christopher Steele did even complete his report and show it to Fusion GPS until August 2016.

 

The pattern is that YOU ARE WRONG.

 

Your narrative about the "never thought it would have to go public" makes no sense.

 

James Comey visited Trump in January 2017 to tell him about the salacious details of the Steele Dossier.

Your narrative is fascinatingly stupid.

 

Explained to me how "this becoming public" was causing the FBI to stumble around like idiots and MAKING THINGS UP to cover their ass.

 

James Comey, James Clapper, and other intelligence officials were giving Trump intelligence briefings in January 2016, and Comey and Clapper stayed to give Trump the key parts of the Steele Dossier.

 

How does you narrative even make sense???????? If they told Trump, Trump himself was obviously going to make it public, right??????????

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I like how @jehurey makes fun of conspiracies, yet fell for an ACTUAL confirmed conspiracy and hoax. 

 

7 hours ago, jehurey said:

 

Your narrative is fascinatingly stupid.

 

Explained to me how "this becoming public" was causing the FBI to stumble around like idiots and MAKING THINGS UP to cover their ass.

 

James Comey, James Clapper, and other intelligence officials were giving Trump intelligence briefings in January 2016, and Comey and Clapper stayed to give Trump the key parts of the Steele Dossier.

 

How does you narrative even make sense???????? If they told Trump, Trump himself was obviously going to make it public, right??????????

you're pretending to not understand because it suddenly makes too much sense, doesn't it? lmfao. Of course they briefed Trump...AFTER he won in November. It was Jan 2017, not 2016. And at the same time they were briefing him, it was LEAKED to the media that he was being briefed...thus making it a STORY and giving it legs for the first time. At some point they HAD to tell him about the allegations. 

7 hours ago, jehurey said:

This third post is to debunk your last three weak responses.

 

I can already tell that you were already losing it and getting angry by this point:

 

You are talking about four FISA warrants on Carter Page that began in 2017.

 

I was talking about Carter Page was under FISA surveillance since 2014. Those warrants, which were being renewed every 3 months, were being done with no Steele Dossier.

 

Oh...........and those 4 warrants beginning 2017..........Inspector General's report found that the first two were perfectly valid, and that the latter two had flaws in the information gathering. But those warrants in 2018 would not have the Steele Dossier at the center of it, since the FBI would've been well underway with their investigation.

 Again, you have your timeline wrong. The surveillance on him began in OCTOBER of 2016 and was extended into 2017. Where does this 2014 come from? Even MUELLER admitted there was no 0 real evidence. He was in contact with Russia for legitimate reasons, and they knew this, but they deliberately targeted him to open the floodgates to spy into the Trump campaign.  And it's not that '2' of the 4 of the warrants were found valid...it's that 2 were found completely INVALID.

 

"Horowitz did fault the FBI for overreaching and mistakes during the investigation. These included failing to disclose when applying for a FISA warrant to surveil Page in October 2016 that he had provided the Central Intelligence Agency details of his prior contacts with Russian officials, including the incident the FBI indicated made Page's conduct most suspicious."

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And your other points are so hilariously crumbling that I barely even have to respond. It's actually hilarious how hollow it is:


1) Russia did interfere in the 2016 election. So did China, Germany, the UK, and others. Whether they had any real effect, and whether others were aware of it, is a different question. They were  doing what countries do, The important part is that Trump had 0 connection to any of it.

 

2) The report that Cohen's cell records showed him in Prague was fake news. It was "leaked," had 0 details or evidence. Cohen denied it. Mueller made nothing of it. Don't you think this massive investigation would pursue it and bring it to light if it had a shred of truth? lmao

 

3)  A random letter of intent to build a tower in Moscow, does not prove that Trump was "offered" sweet real-estate deals. Where is the actual proof?

 

you have been advancing a HOLLOW conspiracy theory, and it's ALL coming to light. LMAO.

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lol Sheepkilla. I can only imagine the beatings he must have caught as a kid. 

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5 minutes ago, Liquid said:

lol Sheepkilla. I can only imagine the beatings he must have caught as a kid. 

At least Jerry tries to post facts to support himself (although completely misguided and wrong). You just post slurs. 

 

@ghostz

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1 minute ago, SheepKilla said:

At least Jerry tries to post facts to support himself (although completely misguided and wrong). You just post slurs. 

 

@ghostz

Jerry has a larger bandwidth for arguing with retards than I do. Like with your buddy Ghostz, When someone is making a fool of himself, I dont see the point in "outsmarting" them. 

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7 minutes ago, SheepKilla said:

At least Jerry tries to post facts to support himself (although completely misguided and wrong). You just post slurs. 

 

@ghostz

Racist remy, back at it. :holeup:

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Just now, Liquid said:

Jerry has a larger bandwidth for arguing with retards than I do. Like with your buddy Ghostz, When someone is making a fool of himself, I dont see the point in "outsmarting" them. 

Instead you just display obvious racism. :mj2:

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Just now, ghostz said:

Jerry got crushed:lawl:

Funniest part is he has even the most basic and undisputed facts wrong, such as for example when this took place.  

 

And these retards chime in to support him because they're spineless. LMAO :lawl: 

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4 hours ago, SheepKilla said:

I like how @jehurey makes fun of conspiracies, yet fell for an ACTUAL confirmed conspiracy and hoax. 

 

you're pretending to not understand because it suddenly makes too much sense, doesn't it? lmfao. Of course they briefed Trump...AFTER he won in November. It was Jan 2017, not 2016. And at the same time they were briefing him, it was LEAKED to the media that he was being briefed...thus making it a STORY and giving it legs for the first time. At some point they HAD to tell him about the allegations. 

 Again, you have your timeline wrong. The surveillance on him began in OCTOBER of 2016 and was extended into 2017. Where does this 2014 come from? Even MUELLER admitted there was no 0 real evidence. He was in contact with Russia for legitimate reasons, and they knew this, but they deliberately targeted him to open the floodgates to spy into the Trump campaign.  And it's not that '2' of the 4 of the warrants were found valid...it's that 2 were found completely INVALID.

 

"Horowitz did fault the FBI for overreaching and mistakes during the investigation. These included failing to disclose when applying for a FISA warrant to surveil Page in October 2016 that he had provided the Central Intelligence Agency details of his prior contacts with Russian officials, including the incident the FBI indicated made Page's conduct most suspicious."

Carter Page HAS HAD FISA WARRANTS ON HIM since 2014.............that is a fact.

 

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/former-trump-adviser-carter-page-under-fisa-warrant-since-2014-report

 

 

Quote

 

Former Trump adviser Carter Page under FISA warrant since 2014: Report

 | August 03, 2017 05:15 PM
 

Carter Page, a foreign policy adviser to during President Trump's campaign, has been the subject of a foreign surveillance warrant since 2014.

 

It was previously reported that Page had been under surveillance since last summer, after he left the campaign.

Page, as well as former campaign chairman Paul Manafort, former national security adviser Mike Flynn, and Trump confidant Roger Stone had been the focus of the Russia investigation even before special counsel Robert Mueller was appointed, according to a CNN report. Mueller has reportedly issued grand jury subpoenas related to the June 2016 meeting Jared Kushner, Donald Trump Jr., and Manafort.

 

It was previously reported that Page had been under surveillance since last summer, after he left the campaign.

The FBI has questioned him numerous times this year. Page said he cooperated and agreed to be interviewed without his lawyer present.

 

Page has long been the subject of federal investigators throughout the Russia investigation amid allegations he either worked as an agent of a foreign government or colluded with one. He runs a New York consulting firm that has done business with Russia.

 

Did I post the story about those two Russians that the FBI were surveilling, and they were talking about the "dimwit" American who was willing to help them???????

 

That was occuring back in 2014. That is when Carter Page first came onto the FBI's radar. That is how long they have been getting FISA warrants on him, because they started following Carter Page.

 

Quote

"Horowitz did fault the FBI for overreaching and mistakes during the investigation. These included failing to disclose when applying for a FISA warrant to surveil Page in October 2016 that he had provided the Central Intelligence Agency details of his prior contacts with Russian officials, including the incident the FBI indicated made Page's conduct most suspicious."

You just proved that they weren't declared invalid because of the Steel Dossier, but rather US Intelligence Agencies failed to provide all information regarding Carter Page when seeking the 3rd and 4th FISA warrants.

 

You're whole narrative was "the FISA warrants were declared as invalid, because it was based on the Steele Dossier, which is completely fake"

 

That's not what happened. They filled out the FISA applications and omitted information they shouldn't have. THAT is why they were declared invalid.

 

No.............you're story does not make any sense. It would've gotten public. The New York Times and WaPo were already spilling lots of info already. The US Intelligence Report on Russian meddling came out during December 2016.

 

DO you understand what a Freedom of Information Act request is.............because the investigations, once closed, would be subject to it, and they'd have to make it public.

 

"It makes too much sense"..........................no it doesn't. Your narrative is PROFOUNDLY STUPID, its one of the weakest conspiracy theories I have ever heard.

 

So they started a HALF-ASSED investigation...........and they immediately had to scramble and cobble together scraps on information once it was coming out to be public? That's your theory??????

4 hours ago, SheepKilla said:

And your other points are so hilariously crumbling that I barely even have to respond. It's actually hilarious how hollow it is:


1) Russia did interfere in the 2016 election. So did China, Germany, the UK, and others. Whether they had any real effect, and whether others were aware of it, is a different question. They were  doing what countries do, The important part is that Trump had 0 connection to any of it.

 

2) The report that Cohen's cell records showed him in Prague was fake news. It was "leaked," had 0 details or evidence. Cohen denied it. Mueller made nothing of it. Don't you think this massive investigation would pursue it and bring it to light if it had a shred of truth? lmao

 

3)  A random letter of intent to build a tower in Moscow, does not prove that Trump was "offered" sweet real-estate deals. Where is the actual proof?

 

you have been advancing a HOLLOW conspiracy theory, and it's ALL coming to light. LMAO.

1. No..............we have proof that Russia hacked the Democratic Party emails and leaked them. We know that Russia had many bot accounts specifically trying to influence the election.

 

Sorry, show your proof on Germany and the UK doing those things. I'll wait.

 

2. It wasn't debunked. Show me the evidence that debunks it, because denials don't mean anything, and Mueller already had Michael Cohen pleading guilty to other crimes.

 

3. Yes it is proof. Trump can't even begin negotiating for a building in Moscow unless Putin allows it. Negotiations had already progressed far along for that letter of intent to have been made.

 

Its not random, its coming straight from Donald Trump and Trump Enterprises. Sorry..............let me know when you can debunk the letter. The letter is authentic, and hard evidence.

 

Sorry..............little too late for you to project yourself onto me. You have a completely weak theory, and I have been ass-raping you and tearing it to pieces every since.

 

Notice how you have not provided ONE PIECE of actual evidence this entire time? Whereas I have names, dates, locations, articles, quotes, and hard evidence like the letter?

 

I can do this all day.

 

You're trying to escape................from YOUR OWN THREAD, no less. lol

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