Why Biden should pardon Trump

[Vini 430]

https://www.nbcnews.com/think/opinion/why-biden-should-pardon-trump-we-democrats-should-want-him-ncna1247986

 

This is a good article. move the f on

[Cooke 2,031]

Lock him up

[Hot Sauce 2,734]

Implicit concession isn't good enough. He's just going to turn around and start Trump TV or partner with OAN, do his MAGA rallies, and continue to sow division in this country. Pardoning him without explicit concession does fuck all nothing towards "healing the country."

[Cooke 2,031]

47 minutes ago, Hot Sauce said:

Implicit concession isn't good enough. He's just going to turn around and start Trump TV or partner with OAN, do his MAGA rallies, and continue to sow division in this country. Pardoning him without explicit concession does fuck all nothing towards "healing the country."

Even if Trump is locked up there will be some new populist right wing guy to take his place. Could be a literal Hitler. Better the devil you know 🙂

[Hot Sauce 2,734]

8 minutes ago, Cooke (not admin cant help said:

Even if Trump is locked up there will be some new populist right wing guy to take his place. Could be a literal Hitler. Better the devil you know 🙂

 

Where do you even find these ridiculous takes?

[Cooke 2,031]

1 hour ago, Hot Sauce said:

 

Where do you even find these ridiculous takes?

Because now the right sees what works. A bombastic idiot "outsider" to excite the base. Incoming Alex Jones 2024 

Edited November 18, 2020 by Cooke (not admin cant help

[Voidler 1,675]

Libs will have his image fully reformed within 2 cycles just like George W Bush

 

By 2030 there will be a new "worst president ever" and they will be reminiscing about the good old Trump days. "At least he was funny" they will say

[Hot Sauce 2,734]

1 hour ago, Cooke (not admin cant help said:

Because now the right sees what works. A bombastic idiot "outsider" to excite the base. Incoming Alex Jones 2024 

 

What "works"? Trump lost as an incumbent in a good economy. He lost two states that haven't gone blue in decades where Republicans that voted against Trump cite him being a bombastic idiot as the reason. He lost Republicans the house twice, including a midterm election that resulted in the first Democratic party control of the house in almost a decade and the largest number of Democratic party seat pick ups since Watergate. And he lost all this despite rampant voter suppression efforts and people like you arguing that Democrats had no chance because their candidate wasn't exciting. Trump is an unmitigated failure.

 

Republicans vote. It's the party's biggest strength when it comes to winning elections. Fox News and AM scare radio never talked their candidates up, they painted the left as evil. The person's name next to the (R) doesn't matter, just the (R). You don't need to excite the Republican base, you just need to keep Democrats home. Trump does the opposite and gets people excited to vote against him.

[Mr. Impossible 411]

8 minutes ago, Hot Sauce said:

 

What "works"? Trump lost as an incumbent in a good economy. He lost two states that haven't gone blue in decades where Republicans that voted against Trump cite him being a bombastic idiot as the reason. He lost Republicans the house twice, including a midterm election that resulted in the first Democratic party control of the house in almost a decade and the largest number of Democratic party seat pick ups since Watergate. And he lost all this despite rampant voter suppression efforts and people like you arguing that Democrats had no chance because their candidate wasn't exciting. Trump is an unmitigated failure.

 

Republicans vote. It's the party's biggest strength when it comes to winning elections. Fox News and AM scare radio never talked their candidates up, they painted the left as evil. The person's name next to the (R) doesn't matter, just the (R). You don't need to excite the Republican base, you just need to keep Democrats home. Trump does the opposite and gets people excited to vote against him.

Trump only lost because Biden received the most votes in an election ever and strong Democratic pushes to utilize more voting opportunities, Trump still received the second largest number of votes so it's not like the country soundly rejected him. Trump also isn't some anomaly, While you're right any Republican candidate is automatically guaranteed 45% of the vote just for having an R next to their name. The right has been grooming their base for two generations for Trump style candidates. The only reason Trump didn't win a second term is that he's a slave to all of his personality disorders. If Trump was able refrain from lying every other sentence, throwing public tantrums on a daily basis, hide is disdain for humanity, and general dictator LARPing. 

 

Will we have another Trump like President? Being a celebrity is what got elected but not any celebrity can just run for President and win. He was the right evil, in the right place, at the right time. This lightening might never strike again, unless one of his kids wants to run. This can and will be effective in local elections however. Someone can easily become a Mayor, or Congressmen, or even Governor because of this. Which is  more influential in Americans' lives. 

[Mr. Impossible 411]

As for the OP. Please keep this in mind next time we hear about "the liberal media" as if they dont always seek to expunge terrible right wing politicians in a heartbeat and offer them a job. While half of Trump's staff were hired from TV, half of those people came from CNN and MSNBC. 

[jehurey 3,258]

There is no "unification" of the country.

 

71 million people literally saw a racist president fail to do the bare minimum that led to a pandemic, personally decide to make a pandemic into a political issue, and then cause 25 million Americans to lose their jobs...........and 73.5 million Americans literally said "..............YEAH, we want four more years of this."

 

They also bought the narrative that Joe Biden was an extremist socialist. JOE BIDEN, of all people.

 

They're not going to be "unified". There is zero chance of that happening. Republican Senators are literally trying to help get ballots tossed out, they didn't do that when Barack Obama won his election against McCain rather swiftly.

 

Can't make the same mistake that the United States did after Reconstruction. We need to put down the criminals, hard.

 

We need to assert legal precedent, so that the next person who wants to attempt the same shit Trump did knows that the last time it was attempted, it results in criminal prosecution and guilty verdicts.

 

And its worth it to piss off the 73.5 million Americans, because its going to galvanize the 79.4 million plus millions of more Americans to find out that its worth it to go back to the polls and re-elect Democrats, because they're actually cleaning up shit.

 

The 73.5 million Americans will get demoralized when they start losing repeated elections, and their boomer crowd continues dying off, and they know that their numbers are dwindling.

[Hot Sauce 2,734]

4 minutes ago, Mr. Impossible said:

Trump only lost because Biden received the most votes in an election ever and strong Democratic pushes to utilize more voting opportunities, Trump still received the second largest number of votes so it's not like the country soundly rejected him.

 

I don't think anything can be meaningfully gleamed from the raw turnout in an election made easier to vote in due to a pandemic. Almost 24-million more votes (so far) were cast for Trump and Biden in 2020 compared to Trump and Clinton in 2016. Of that difference, 56% went towards the increase in Biden's popular vote total over Clinton's.

 

34 minutes ago, Mr. Impossible said:

Trump also isn't some anomaly, While you're right any Republican candidate is automatically guaranteed 45% of the vote just for having an R next to their name. The right has been grooming their base for two generations for Trump style candidates.

 

I don't agree. The right has been grooming their base to be anti-Democratic party to hold power regardless of the person attached to the (R). It made them susceptible to having that anti-Democrat ideology hijacked, which Trump did, but nobody wanted a Trump candidate because he doesn't care about the party, just himself and is volatile to the detriment of the party.

 

46 minutes ago, Mr. Impossible said:

The only reason Trump didn't win a second term is that he's a slave to all of his personality disorders. If Trump was able refrain from lying every other sentence, throwing public tantrums on a daily basis, hide is disdain for humanity, and general dictator LARPing. 

 

So if Trump wasn't Trump? You know what I'd call somebody who was Trump but had self-control and pushed Trump's policies in a more nuanced manner and without the lying? Any other candidate for the Republican nomination.

 

2 hours ago, Mr. Impossible said:

Will we have another Trump like President? Being a celebrity is what got elected but not any celebrity can just run for President and win. He was the right evil, in the right place, at the right time. This lightening might never strike again, unless one of his kids wants to run. This can and will be effective in local elections however. Someone can easily become a Mayor, or Congressmen, or even Governor because of this. Which is  more influential in Americans' lives. 

 

Reagan was a celebrity turned president 40 years ago and we've had celebrities as mayors, congressmen, and governors before Trump. I don't know what big change you're believing has occurred as a result of Trump.

[Mr. Impossible 411]

34 minutes ago, jehurey said:

There is no "unification" of the country.

 

71 million people literally saw a racist president fail to do the bare minimum that led to a pandemic, personally decide to make a pandemic into a political issue, and then cause 25 million Americans to lose their jobs...........and 73.5 million Americans literally said "..............YEAH, we want four more years of this."

 

They also bought the narrative that Joe Biden was an extremist socialist. JOE BIDEN, of all people.

 

They're not going to be "unified". There is zero chance of that happening. Republican Senators are literally trying to help get ballots tossed out, they didn't do that when Barack Obama won his election against McCain rather swiftly.

 

Can't make the same mistake that the United States did after Reconstruction. We need to put down the criminals, hard.

 

We need to assert legal precedent, so that the next person who wants to attempt the same shit Trump did knows that the last time it was attempted, it results in criminal prosecution and guilty verdicts.

 

And its worth it to piss off the 73.5 million Americans, because its going to galvanize the 79.4 million plus millions of more Americans to find out that its worth it to go back to the polls and re-elect Democrats, because they're actually cleaning up shit.

 

The 73.5 million Americans will get demoralized when they start losing repeated elections, and their boomer crowd continues dying off, and they know that their numbers are dwindling.

In reality this is a stupid article meant to appeal to stupid people (sorry Vini) that simply support Trump, but are at least in touch with reality enough to accept that he lost the election. How anyone can think for a second there would be a good affect of having the most corrupt President in history pardoned just to make his supporters happy. Forget kneeling, flag burning, or statue toppling, that is the most dangerous and corrosive sentiment. To reward the corrupt elites. 

[Mr. Impossible 411]

4 minutes ago, Hot Sauce said:

Quote

 

I don't think anything can be meaningfully gleamed from the raw turnout in an election made easier to vote in due to a pandemic. Almost 24-million more votes (so far) were cast for Trump and Biden in 2020 compared to Trump and Clinton in 2016. Of that difference, 56% went towards the increase in Biden's popular vote total over Clinton's.

 

There's not direct way to compare or need. It still shows that over 70 million people supported him for President, and his approval rating among the party is 96%. That's a lot of people. 

 

Quote

I don't agree. The right has been grooming their base to be anti-Democratic party to hold power regardless of the person attached to the (R). It made them susceptible to having that anti-Democrat ideology hijacked, which Trump did, but nobody wanted a Trump candidate because he doesn't care about the party, just himself and is volatile to the detriment of the party.

Our points aren't mutually exclusive. It's not just about being anti-Dem, they're anti-doctor, anti-science, anti-higher learning (despite every Republican rep having gone to Ivy League schools.), anti-media, anti-Politically correct. Politics took a backseat to culture so a candidate who knows jackshit about policy can win a successful campaign on keeping brown people in check. A man that told people that every other person was lying to them but him, that none of the experts knew what they were talking about, except him. Proudly stated how politically incorrect he was. Yes, he used the anti-Dem lines the right loves but Trump is the byproduct of the toxic waste the right politicians and media dumped into the minds of their voters. 

 

 

Quote

So if Trump wasn't Trump? You know what I'd call somebody who was Trump but had self-control and pushed Trump's policies in a more nuanced manner and without the lying? Any other candidate for the Republican nomination.

TBH, you're actually countering your original point right now. You claimed that "Trump didnt prove what works", whilst also pointing out that his bombast was actually the only difference between him and the very candidates whose asses he kicked and collectively kiss his ass. I dont equate too much of someone as rejecting that person on the whole. 

 

Quote

Reagan was a celebrity turned president 40 years ago and we've had celebrities as mayors, congressmen, and governors before Trump. I don't know what big change you're believing has occurred as a result of Trump.

I literally said that anyone could become an elected politician up to the Gov position because of fame. Reagan was a celebrity but by the time he ran for President he had already been a Governor prior and had long since stopped acting. Trump was negotiating TV contracts when he announced he was running and never had any political experience. Presidential voting has long has certain parameters different than other positions. Namely executive experience. It's very hard and used to be even harder for someone to become POTUS without having run a municipality in some way. It's why former Govs used to have much more success than Senators in becoming Prez. 

 

[Hot Sauce 2,734]

12 minutes ago, Mr. Impossible said:

There's not direct way to compare or need. It still shows that over 70 million people supported him for President, and his approval rating among the party is 96%. That's a lot of people. 

 

And? I've never said anything about those people not mattering. All I've said is that those people would have voted for Jeb Bush in a presidential election, too.

 

13 minutes ago, Mr. Impossible said:

Our points aren't mutually exclusive. It's not just about being anti-Dem, they're anti-doctor, anti-science, anti-higher learning (despite every Republican rep having gone to Ivy League schools.), anti-media, anti-Politically correct. Politics took a backseat to culture so a candidate who knows jackshit about policy can win a successful campaign on keeping brown people in check. A man that told people that every other person was lying to them but him, that none of the experts knew what they were talking about, except him. Proudly stated how politically incorrect he was. Yes, he used the anti-Dem lines the right loves but Trump is the byproduct of the toxic waste the right politicians and media dumped into the minds of their voters. 

 

How much of this is pre-Trump? Trump being so profoundly politically incorrect is definitely unique for an elected official at that level, but we've seen that anti-SJW non-sense peddled on here for years prior to Trump. Everything else was always there and generally built up through an anti-Demcratic party lens (ie. anti-higher learning because educated people don't vote R nearly as often as uneducated people do).

 

I think we just disagree on Trump being the intention of the rhetoric, not that he is the result of it.

 

23 minutes ago, Mr. Impossible said:

TBH, you're actually countering your original point right now. You claimed that "Trump didnt prove what works", whilst also pointing out that his bombast was actually the only difference between him and the very candidates whose asses he kicked and collectively kiss his ass. I dont equate too much of someone as rejecting that person on the whole. 

 

Why do you think calling an incumbent who lost re-election in a favorable economy a failure is contradicted by what happened 4 years ago? The entire argument is that Trump's buffoonery in office drove more Democratic party voters than Republican voters to the polls, as evidenced by the 2018 midterm and the 2020 presidential election. Under what logic do you think Trump proved what works? Winning a party's nomination and being a one term president? That's the evidence that the Trump mold is the future? I really don't believe that to be true.

 

This is also a silly stance to take because Trump only won the nomination due to vote splitting. Go look at the 2016 Republican primary results and tell me Trump beats Cruz if Rubio and Kasich drop out sooner. A win is a win, but if the GOP did to Trump what the Democratic party did to Bernie this year then there is no Trump nomination.

 

The Republican party always falls in line, so I don't think Republican nomination losers kissing ass is even worth discussing outside of laughing at Cruz phonebanking for the person that called his wife ugly.

 

2 hours ago, Mr. Impossible said:

I literally said that anyone could become an elected politician up to the Gov position because of fame. Reagan was a celebrity but by the time he ran for President he had already been a Governor prior and had long since stopped acting. Trump was negotiating TV contracts when he announced he was running and never had any political experience. Presidential voting has long has certain parameters different than other positions. Namely executive experience. It's very hard and used to be even harder for someone to become POTUS without having run a municipality in some way. It's why former Govs used to have much more success than Senators in becoming Prez.

 

What you said was that another Trump at the presidential level was unlikely, but that "this" would be effective in local elections. Local elections have always had the non-politician candidates and are far more partisan (synonym: batshit) than national candidates because the constituency is far more partisan and that partisan rhetoric is far more safe at a local level. I completely agree that Reagan and Trump are different, but if you don't think Trump at the presidential level is likely again then what has changed?

 

I cannot see another Trump at the presidential level either, I don't see how this will change local elections, and there is no way the GOP promotes Trump-style local candidates after having to pretend to like Trump. Unless Trump runs again in 2024 I view this as the death of Trumpism. They'll put a Nikki Haley at the top of the ticket, the policies won't change, but they'll pretend to not be a party of assholes again.

[Goukosan 2,258]

7 hours ago, Voidler said:

Libs will have his image fully reformed within 2 cycles just like George W Bush

 

By 2030 there will be a new "worst president ever" and they will be reminiscing about the good old Trump days. "At least he was funny" they will say

 

Oh don't be fooled. Trump is getting prosecuted the minute he leaves office.  Biden's Administration isn't directly going after him, but he will be taken down.  The cases are already lined up and waiting 😎

[Voidler 1,675]

8 minutes ago, Goukosan said:

 

Oh don't be fooled. Trump is getting prosecuted the minute he leaves office.  Biden's Administration isn't directly going after him, but he will be taken down.  The cases are already lined up and waiting 😎

Hope so

 

But Bush and his administration should have been tried for war crimes so I'm not hopeful

 

Instead we've had liberals completely reforming his image in the Trump era and Bush republicans aligning with Democrats via the Lincoln project

 

They did it to Reagan as well

[Goukosan 2,258]

Just now, Voidler said:

Hope so

 

But Bush and his administration should have been tried for war crimes so I'm not hopeful

 

Instead we've had liberals completely reforming his image in the Trump era and Bush republicans aligning with Democrats via the Lincoln project

 

They did it to Reagan as well

 

Bush and Reagan did unethical things.  Trump actually committed multiple crimes, big difference. 

[lostfool 680]

I can't wait until Trump gets raped in prison.  

[Voidler 1,675]

1 hour ago, Goukosan said:

 

Bush and Reagan did unethical things.  Trump actually committed multiple crimes, big difference. 

An illegal invasion of Iraq and lying the country into war for oil, just unethical?

 

Selling illegal weapons to Iran just unethical?

 

Smuggling cocaine into the country just unethical?

 

Funding right wing terrorist contras in South America just unethical?

 

Okay mate