Digital Foundry; Sonic Team Racing Xbox1X/S and Switch Analysis.

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Let's recap:

 

-It's losing on the majority of multiplats.

 

-There are 0 exclusives that take advantage of the hardware. There are 0 exclusives period.

 

Easy choice to make for anyone in the market for a new console. In fact it's not even a contest.  

[DynamiteCop 2,088]

1 minute ago, Bodycount N said:

Let's recap:

 

-It's losing on the majority of multiplats.

 

-There are 0 exclusives that take advantage of the hardware. There are 0 exclusives period.

 

Easy choice to make for anyone in the market for a new console. In fact it's not even a contest.  

"You're the dumbest person on this board."

[Quad Damage 1,763]

17 minutes ago, DynamiteCop! said:

No, you're not understanding. It's not arguable that they're in line with each other or that the Pro is besting the X, it's arguable that the total package is better served on X because of large concessions on the Pro needed to "outperform it"

 

There's gray area that you people like to discount and ignore such as resolution and graphical settings, post processing levels etc.  

 

"Oh it runs at a 3% better framerate, win!!!"

 

-"But it's rendering at a 78% higher resolution on the X..."

 

"No it's a win!!!"

 

That's the logic...

 

the logic is you just proved aza's point - 8 arguable, 2 definitive wins by deeno math

 

the objective verdict as delivered by df is the majority were best on pro or negligible.

[102020393023445948594 2,223]

god of war on base PS4 looks better than anything on DoneX. 

 

Specs on paper mean jack shit. 0 exclusives, 0 1P Support, and 3rd party devs couldn't be bothered to utilize DoneX's specs to its advantage because nobody bought one + nobody cares.

 

It's a wrap, DoneX is finished and will be replaced very soon anyways. Anyone who bought one got conned hook, line and sinker by huckster Phil.

[DynamiteCop 2,088]

Just now, Quad Damage said:

 

the logic is you just proved aza's point - 8 arguable, 2 definitive wins by deeno math

 

the objective verdict as delivered by df is the majority were best on pro or negligible.

In 6 of those 8 games the X is factually outperforming the Pro by a substantive margin with all things considered. There's more going on in its builds whether it be resolution, graphical settings, post process effects or a culmination of all three. If evenly configured to the X settings the Pro would be a landslide defeat in every single one of them. The only reason it's "arguable" is because the Pro will be operating at different/lower settings which results in a slightly better framerate, but when compared that perceived advantage doesn't come close to eclipsing the advantages seen on the X.

 

The 2 out of 8 where the Pro is evenly matched/beating the X it's because the level of optimization done on the Pro is considerable better than seen on the X, if properly optimized it would again be a landslide defeat for the Pro. 

[Goukosan 2,283]

26 minutes ago, DynamiteCop! said:

Their conclusions are meaningless and you need to learn this kiddo, subjective interpretation and injected viewpoints have no bearing on analysis of data or where it lands. 

 

Any time they dont say Xbox version is the best... you say their conclusions are meaningless...... but when they say the Xbox version is the best.. all of a sudden their conclusions are legit? 

 

What Analysis tools have you used to analyze these games? 

 

Have you played all versions to compare them? 

 

Have you professionally analyzed games for years? 

 

Conclusion.... Shut the fuck up you biased cunt 

Edited June 2, 2019 by Goukosan

[DynamiteCop 2,088]

9 minutes ago, Bodycount N said:

god of war on base PS4 looks better than anything on DoneX. 

 

Specs on paper mean jack shit. 0 exclusives, 0 1P Support, and 3rd party devs couldn't be bothered to utilize DoneX's specs to its advantage because nobody bought one + nobody cares.

 

It's a wrap, DoneX is finished and will be replaced very soon anyways. Anyone who bought one got conned hook, line and sinker by huckster Phil.

Who is being conned?

 

PlayStation 4 Pro

 

• 934 days at market
• 437 enhanced games
• 0.46 games enhanced per day

 

Xbox One X

 

• 572 days at market
• 469 enhanced games
• 0.81 games enhanced per day

 

5 minutes ago, Goukosan said:

 

Any time they dont say Xbox version is the best... you say their conclusions are meaningless...... but when they say the Xbox version is the best.. all of a sudden their conclusions are legit? 

 

What Analysis tools have you used to analyze these games? 

 

Have you played all versions to compare them? 

 

Have you professionally analyzed games for years? 

 

Conclusion.... Shut the fuck up you biased cunt 

I always say their conclusions are meaningless, I never extrapolate on their opinions, only their data. 

 

You're brain dead.

Edited June 2, 2019 by DynamiteCop!

[Quad Damage 1,763]

1 minute ago, DynamiteCop! said:

In 6 of those 8 games the X is factually outperforming the Pro by a substantive margin with all things considered. There's more going on in its builds whether it be resolution, graphical settings, post process effects or a culmination of all three. If evenly configured to the X settings the Pro would be a landslide defeat in every single one of them. The only reason it's "arguable" is because the Pro will be operating at different/lower settings which results in a slightly better framerate, but when compared that perceived advantage doesn't come close to eclipsing the advantages seen on the X.

 

The 2 out of 8 where the Pro is evenly matched/beating the X it's because the level of optimization done on the Pro is considerable better than seen on the X, if properly optimized it would again be a landslide defeat for the Pro. 

 

your first mistake is believing everything begins and ends with image quality, when it actually begins and ends with performance - because, you know, you actually play the games not just look at screenshots. thats why df has concluded pro, with an assist by its 1080p mode, their preferred way to play multiplats as much as they have this year.

 

your second mistake is not realizing that if xbox one x was worth a shit, there wouldnt be any gray areas or constant push-pulls between visual and performances - it would just deliver the best of both and actually should be doing so by a considerable margin, and that is simply not the case through june 2019.  this was aza's point in a nutshell.

[DynamiteCop 2,088]

Just now, Quad Damage said:

 

your first mistake is believing everything begins and ends with image quality, when it actually begins and ends with performance - because, you know, you actually play the games not just look at screenshots. thats why df has concluded pro, with an assist by its 1080p mode, their preferred way to play multiplats as much as they have this year.

 

your second mistake is not realizing that if xbox one x was worth a shit, there wouldnt be any gray areas or constant push-pulls between visual and performances - it would just deliver the best of both and actually should be doing so by a considerable margin, and that is simply not the case through june 2019.  this was aza's point in a nutshell.

It doesn't begin and end with image quality, however there is a "push-pull" between it and performance. I didn't buy a 4K TV to play near or at 1080p games, if that were the case I would still be using base consoles. I bought it for games trying to hit 4K or come as close to it as possible, that is why these systems exist.

 

When your solution to gain a 3-5% FPS advantage is to give the opposing platform a settings and/or 75-300% resolution advantage you have absolutely lost the fucking plot. $400 to play at 1080p or some middling resolution with a bit of an FPS boost, *golf clap*... That performance gain does not justify a loss in IQ to that degree, not just because of the subject matter of the games and it not only being quite inconsequential overall but because it belittles not only the system purchase but also the Television purchase as well. 

 

It undermines both of their existences entirely and the money you have spent. If it was such a concern you would be on a PC and solely on a PC, the entire narrative is a red herring with the intention of distracting from the rest of what is going on. 

 

[Quad Damage 1,763]

2 minutes ago, DynamiteCop! said:

It doesn't begin and end with image quality, however there is a "push-pull" between it and performance. I didn't buy a 4K TV to play near or at 1080p games, if that were the case I would still be using base consoles. I bought it for games trying to hit 4K or come as close to it as possible, that is why these systems exist.

 

When your solution to gain a 3-5% FPS advantage is to give the opposing platform a settings and/or 75-300% resolution advantage you have absolutely lost the fucking plot. $400 to play at 1080p or some middling resolution with a bit of an FPS boost, *golf clap*... That performance gain does not justify a loss in IQ to that degree, not just because of the subject matter of the games and it not only being quite inconsequential overall but because it belittles not only the system purchase but also the Television purchase as well. 

 

It undermines both of their existences entirely and the money you have spent. If it was such a concern you would be on a PC and solely on a PC, the entire narrative is a red herring with the intention of distracting from the rest of what is going on. 

 

 

the fact that you're not sensitive to frame drops, or that you bought a 4k tv, doesnt change the x versions from being juddery shit.

[Goukosan 2,283]

12 minutes ago, DynamiteCop! said:

I always say their conclusions are meaningless, I never extrapolate on their opinions, only their data. 

 

You're straight up lying now. 

 

When DF had the exclusive reveal of X... you loved them.

 

When they pointed out the X enhanced games... you loved them. 

 

When they said RDR2 was best on X.. you loved them. 

 

But.... Once X started to loose some comparisons to Pro..... that's when you turned on them.... you expected EVERY SINGLE GAME to be better in X.... and now that reality did shape out how you thought it would..... and you can't deal with it 

[DynamiteCop 2,088]

15 minutes ago, Quad Damage said:

 

the fact that you're not sensitive to frame drops, or that you bought a 4k tv, doesnt change the x versions from being juddery shit.

It's not that I'm not sensitive, I simply understand that the difference is so menial that such a massive loss in IQ doesn't justify such a minute gain in performance especially when in several of those cases the Pro is still experiencing drops. I also understand that games get patches and subsequent optimizations and rarely land where they are initially analysed.

 

 I also understand on top of this that the higher the IQ ceiling the more future proofed the title is. You brought up Dead or Alive 6 which is a glaring example of exactly that. It's 1080p across the board on PS4 Pro, but the X has a perfectly operating 1080p mode and a native 4K mode it can't handle.  

 

What do you think happens when next-gen systems come out in a little over a year and both are backward compatible with the Pro and X? That 1080p is still going to be 1080p on Sony's next system, but it will be in 4K on the Xbox with a perfectly locked framerate. This is going to be the overarching reality for literally hundreds of games, the Pro builds will be perpetually stuck in no man's land while the X builds shine even more than they presently do. 

 

You're not evaluating the bigger picture, you're small minded and think some small single aspect victory is considering the whole when it's actually disregarding it entirely. 

5 minutes ago, Goukosan said:

You're straight up lying now. 

 

When DF had the exclusive reveal of X... you loved them.

 

When they pointed out the X enhanced games... you loved them. 

 

When they said RDR2 was best on X.. you loved them. 

 

But.... Once X started to loose some comparisons to Pro..... that's when you turned on them.... you expected EVERY SINGLE GAME to be better in X.... and now that reality did shape out how you thought it would..... and you can't deal with it 

Not at all true, not one damn bit. I didn't turn on them, I turned on you people who were latching onto their personal thoughts instead of solidified rendering metrics. I've remained entirely consistent in the analysis of data, opinion has never been on the table. 

Edited June 2, 2019 by DynamiteCop!

[Goukosan 2,283]

Just now, DynamiteCop! said:

It's not that I'm not sensitive, I simply understand that the difference is so menial that such a massive loss in IQ doesn't justify such a minute gain in performance especially when in several of those cases the Pro is still experiencing drops. I also understand that games get patches and subsequent optimizations and rarely land where they are initially analysed.

 

 I also understand on top of this that the higher the IQ ceiling the more future proofed the title is. You brought up Dead or Alive 6 which is a glaring example of exactly that. It's 1080p across the board on PS4 Pro, but the X has a perfectly operating 1080p mode and a native 4K mode it can't handle.  

 

What do you think happens when next-gen systems come out in a little over a year and both are backward compatible with the Pro and X? That 1080p is still going to be 1080p on Sony's next system, but it will be in 4K on the Xbox with a perfectly locked framerate.

 

You're not evaluating the bigger picture, you're small minded and think some small single aspect victory is considering the whole when it's actually disregarding it entirely. 

Not at all true, not one damn bit. I didn't turn on them, I turned on you people who were latching onto their personal thoughts instead of solidified rendering metrics. I've remained entirely consistent in the analysis of data, opinion has never been on the table. 

performance of a videogame taking a priority over image quality is not an opinion. 

 

Video games are an interactive medium.... you're not just sitting there staring an still screen shots. 

 

The fact that you thought X would run most games in native 4K.... thought that devs would put all Their resources behind X.... when it's market position ( selling like shit... has a smaller user base than base X, 1S, Base PS4, Pro and Switch) doesnt justify devs maximizing games for X. 

 

For crying out loud... even MS has yet to put out a Marque showcase game for X 

 

You flip flop all over the place and can't think outside the box.... you always look at shit from a biased lends... You can't see past your nose...twist reality to suit your BS.. 

 

Look at this thread for example... it's a DF thread and you tried to change their conclusions because it didn't suit your bias. 

 

Reality check... DF are professionals... their analysis carries a ton on weight in our industry because it's on point.

 

 

Your analysis comes from your ass and carries ZERO weight... anywhere 

[Guest]

Once you hit 1440p or higher, performance is all that matters. Who gives a shit about 4k unless youre gaming on a big ass TV. 

 

 

 

Edited June 2, 2019 by Guest

[Quad Damage 1,763]

13 minutes ago, DynamiteCop! said:

It's not that I'm not sensitive, I simply understand that the difference is so menial that such a massive loss in IQ doesn't justify such a minute gain in performance especially when in several of those cases the Pro is still experiencing drops. I also understand that games get patches and subsequent optimizations and rarely land where they are initially analysed.

 

 I also understand on top of this that the higher the IQ ceiling the more future proofed the title is. You brought up Dead or Alive 6 which is a glaring example of exactly that. It's 1080p across the board on PS4 Pro, but the X has a perfectly operating 1080p mode and a native 4K mode it can't handle.  

 

What do you think happens when next-gen systems come out in a little over a year and both are backward compatible with the Pro and X? That 1080p is still going to be 1080p on Sony's next system, but it will be in 4K on the Xbox with a perfectly locked framerate. This is going to be the overarching reality for literally hundreds of games, the Pro builds will be perpetually stuck in no man's land while the X builds shine even more than they presently do. 

 

You're not evaluating the bigger picture, you're small minded and think some small single aspect victory is considering the whole when it's actually disregarding it entirely. 

Not at all true, not one damn bit. I didn't turn on them, I turned on you people who were latching onto their personal thoughts instead of solidified rendering metrics. I've remained entirely consistent in the analysis of data, opinion has never been on the table. 

 

sorry chief, just because youre desperate to justify your setup, doesnt change the juddery xbox versions or the objective df verdicts

[DynamiteCop 2,088]

Just now, Quad Damage said:

 

sorry chief, just because youre desperate to justify your setup, doesnt change the juddery xbox versions or the objective df verdicts

So you're walking away from objective reality, shocking. 

[Goukosan 2,283]

6 minutes ago, DynamiteCop! said:

So you're walking away from objective reality, shocking. 

The lack of self awareness by you is astounding 

[DynamiteCop 2,088]

20 minutes ago, Goukosan said:

performance of a videogame taking a priority over image quality is not an opinion. 

 

Video games are an interactive medium.... you're not just sitting there staring an still screen shots. 

 

The fact that you thought X would run most games in native 4K.... thought that devs would put all Their resources behind X.... when it's market position ( selling like shit... has a smaller user base than base X, 1S, Base PS4, Pro and Switch) doesnt justify devs maximizing games for X. 

 

For crying out loud... even MS has yet to put out a Marque showcase game for X 

 

You flip flop all over the place and can't think outside the box.... you always look at shit from a biased lends... You can't see past your nose...twist reality to suit your BS.. 

 

Look at this thread for example... it's a DF thread and you tried to change their conclusions because it didn't suit your bias. 

 

Reality check... DF are professionals... their analysis carries a ton on weight in our industry because it's on point.

 

 

Your analysis comes from your ass and carries ZERO weight... anywhere 

Oh shut the fuck up.

 

It doesn't take priority when it's such an overarching inconsequential difference that you would by and large need tools to even perceive its difference between the two platforms, and even worse as I told the other moron in here when the other system is still in fact dropping frames. 

 

I never said anything about most games being native 4K, that is yet another lie in your never ending playbook of them. Dev's are putting their resources behind the X, that's why it has more enhanced games, that's why it's getting more of them at a higher frequency, that's why out of probably 400 shared titles there's only couple where it falls behind. 

 

They've put out plenty of "marque showcase" games for the X you're just too much of a fucking moron to see it. All the games from Microsoft for the X push not only higher resolution but also higher graphical settings. Do you think Forza Horizon 4 looks as it does on the S as it does on the X? Sorry but I hate to break it to you, it doesn't. 

 

You function on feelings and opinions, you're a leftist so it's not a shock that your lifestyle mantra carries over into the analysis of video game data. You don't derive anything from the facts of the analysis, you solely hamstring yourself to the opinions and subjective conclusions. but not the data.

 

You're as worthless as an opinion is relative to data. 

 

Edited June 2, 2019 by DynamiteCop!

[DynamiteCop 2,088]

4 minutes ago, Goukosan said:

The lack of self awareness by you is astounding 

A verdict is not objective, it's subjective personal viewpoint extrapolated from analysis of the data. Only the data itself is objective, not what they think of it.

 

Go back to school baby brain. 

[Remij 4,717]

Resolution matters less now.  That's a simple fact.  Mostly because temporal AA fixes most of the major problems with resolutions like 1080p and 1440p.  4K obviously resolves much better details, but the worst thing about lower resolutions was the jaggy teporally unstable image it produced.  Now we have post processing effects which enhance details, reduce jaggies, among other things, which improve the image quality well beyond what a game WOULD have looked like at those resolutions without those effects.  Now games are getting into the more filmic presentation and the fact is, with all these processes... 1440p+ all looks really fucking good.  Especially when you consider a 1440p game that's attempting to push visual boundaries.

 

As I said in a previous post in another thread... resolution will become less of an important measure of visuals in the future.  We wont even be able to tell the difference in resolutions with the amount of effects games will have... at that point.. it's good enough.. and we either want performance, or asset quality to improve.