Russia has officially invaded Ukraine

[Mr. House 3,371]

39 minutes ago, Goukosan said:

 

Cooke you're as dumb as rocks....

 

You claimed for years that Biden is some powerful all Mighty war monger who wants to take us into perpetual wars and maybe even WWIII... but now you're saying he is an inept old buffoon... Who Putin thought was weak and wouldn't do anything about it.... Which is it? 

 

 

As far as Trump is concerned.. 

 

Did you forget Trump got impeached for withholding aide to Ukraine unless they fabricate lies against Biden? 

 

Trump wanted the US to pull out of NATO with the ultimate goal NATO disbanding ... That was his goal.... 

 

 

Which would have then left Russia unchecked to invade those nations would be invaded and the peace deals would be for Russia to take over. 

 

If Trump were president Russia would have already taken over Ukraine and NATO would be disbanded or severely weakened by the US pulling out of the alliance. 

 

Now under "inept buffon" Biden.. Russia has been exposed as weak and pathetic... And the NATO alliance is stronger than ever as other countries have joined. 

 

Putin's plan backfired spectacularly

You're distorting facts. Trump threatened to pull out of NATO because he wanted European countries to INCREASE their defense budgets and contribute more militarily and also be energy independent from Russia... None of which would have benefitted Putin.

 

[Mr. House 3,371]

Anyway

 

Interesting recap of events. He also make a good point in how Putin can now freely punish traitors among the army who was sympathetic to the coup. I mean the high ranking members.

[Cooke 2,041]

2 hours ago, jehurey said:

as I already explained in my previous posts......its hilarious how you can't seem to specifically address it.

 

And you pathetic response was to ALLOW an invasion and more deaths.

 

He really has.

 

I 100% attribute this to him absolutely being in a constant state of self-loathing.

 

Like most of these alt-right'ers end up being.

Self loathing. I'm starting to think you have no idea what that even means. 😂

[Cooke 2,041]

1 hour ago, Goukosan said:

 

Cooke you're as dumb as rocks....

 

You claimed for years that Biden is some powerful all Mighty war monger who wants to take us into perpetual wars and maybe even WWIII... but now you're saying he is an inept old buffoon... Who Putin thought was weak and wouldn't do anything about it.... Which is it? 

 

 

As far as Trump is concerned.. 

 

Did you forget Trump got impeached for withholding aide to Ukraine unless they fabricate lies against Biden? 

 

Trump wanted the US to pull out of NATO with the ultimate goal NATO disbanding ... That was his goal.... 

 

 

Which would have then left Russia unchecked to invade those nations would be invaded and the peace deals would be for Russia to take over. 

 

If Trump were president Russia would have already taken over Ukraine and NATO would be disbanded or severely weakened by the US pulling out of the alliance. 

 

Now under "inept buffon" Biden.. Russia has been exposed as weak and pathetic... And the NATO alliance is stronger than ever as other countries have joined. 

 

Putin's plan backfired spectacularly

Hey genius. Two things can be true at the same time. 

 

1 Trump is unpredictable and wreckless which would probably prevent Putin from invading Ukraine during his presidency. 

 

2 Biden is a Warhawk (he has a very long history of voting for every single intervention possible) but he is also predictable and did not take the steps necessary to protect Ukraine before the invasion like accept them into NATO. 

[jehurey 3,299]

3 hours ago, Cooke said:

Self loathing. I'm starting to think you have no idea what that even means. 😂

I absolutely do know what it means.

 

In fact, it would absolutely benefit you if you truly understood what it meant, because it would explain SO MUCH about you these past few years.

[lynux3 2,165]

 

[Goukosan 2,283]

6 hours ago, Ramza said:

You're distorting facts. Trump threatened to pull out of NATO because he wanted European countries to INCREASE their defense budgets and contribute more militarily and also be energy independent from Russia... None of which would have benefitted Putin.

 

 

That was his plan to gain public support for pulling out of NATO... First claim we're playing too much then say it's obsolete and pull out. 

 

 

 

Trump's own national security advisor said Trump wanted to do it..... Trump himself said he was musing the idea during his first term... And his aides, defense sectary and national security advisor said he would have done it if he was re-elected in 2020.

 

 

 

"National Security Advisor John Bolton says 'Putin was waiting' for Trump to withdraw the United States from NATO in his second term" 

 

"He previously warned that Trump would have withdrawn from the alliance if he'd won a 2nd term." 

 

 

 

Hia top aides including his defense secretary confirmed as much. 

 

"Trump was considering pulling out of Nato and cutting the US’s alliance with South Korea if he won the 2020 election, according to an account of his private meetings with top aides." 

 

"In fact, Trump had privately indicated that he would seek to withdraw from Nato and to blow up the US alliance with South Korea, should he win reelection. When those alliances had come up in meetings with Esper and other top aides, some advisers warned Trump that shredding them before the election would be politically dangerous"

 

 

Then in a prior interview interview Trump already confirmed what the aides, his defense secretary and National security advisor said about him wanting to pull out of NATO. 

 

 

Halperin: Should America be the leader of NATO or not necessarily?

 

Trump: I think NATO may be obsolete. NATO was set up a long time ago — many, many years ago when things were different. Things are different now. We were a rich nation then. We had nothing but money. We had nothing but power. And you know, far more than we have today, in a true sense. And I think NATO — you have to really examine NATO. And it doesn’t really help us, it’s helping other countries. And I don’t think those other countries appreciate what we’re doing.

 

Heilemann: But it’s possible that NATO is obsolete and should be gotten rid of?

 

Trump: It’s possible. It’s possible. I would certainly look at it.

 

 

You were saying?

 

[Mr. House 3,371]

1 hour ago, Goukosan said:

 

That was his plan to gain public support for pulling out of NATO... First claim we're playing too much then say it's obsolete and pull out. 

 

 

 

Trump's own national security advisor said Trump wanted to do it..... Trump himself said he was musing the idea during his first term... And his aides, defense sectary and national security advisor said he would have done it if he was re-elected in 2020.

 

 

 

"National Security Advisor John Bolton says 'Putin was waiting' for Trump to withdraw the United States from NATO in his second term" 

 

"He previously warned that Trump would have withdrawn from the alliance if he'd won a 2nd term." 

 

 

 

Hia top aides including his defense secretary confirmed as much. 

 

"Trump was considering pulling out of Nato and cutting the US’s alliance with South Korea if he won the 2020 election, according to an account of his private meetings with top aides." 

 

"In fact, Trump had privately indicated that he would seek to withdraw from Nato and to blow up the US alliance with South Korea, should he win reelection. When those alliances had come up in meetings with Esper and other top aides, some advisers warned Trump that shredding them before the election would be politically dangerous"

 

 

Then in a prior interview interview Trump already confirmed what the aides, his defense secretary and National security advisor said about him wanting to pull out of NATO. 

 

 

Halperin: Should America be the leader of NATO or not necessarily?

 

Trump: I think NATO may be obsolete. NATO was set up a long time ago — many, many years ago when things were different. Things are different now. We were a rich nation then. We had nothing but money. We had nothing but power. And you know, far more than we have today, in a true sense. And I think NATO — you have to really examine NATO. And it doesn’t really help us, it’s helping other countries. And I don’t think those other countries appreciate what we’re doing.

 

Heilemann: But it’s possible that NATO is obsolete and should be gotten rid of?

 

Trump: It’s possible. It’s possible. I would certainly look at it.

 

 

You were saying?

 

Your point? Everyone saw NATO has an dinosaur at the time that didn't serve much purposes in recent decades.

 

The US could still be just as involved in this conflict as a part of NATO or not. It's just an alliance. This isn't the end of all arguments that you think it is. The US not being part of NATO in no way ensure Putin success in the Ukrainian war or guarantee the US non involvement in the conflict.  

 

Trump wanted European NATO countries to increase their military budget and not rely solely on the US.

Trump wanted European countries to be energy independent from Russia. 

 

Trump wanted to pull out of NATO. OMG, Putin ally, confirmed. 

 

LOL. 

 

[Goukosan 2,283]

2 hours ago, Ramza said:

Your point? Everyone saw NATO has an dinosaur at the time that didn't serve much purposes in recent decades.

 

The US could still be just as involved in this conflict as a part of NATO or not. It's just an alliance. This isn't the end of all arguments that you think it is. The US not being part of NATO in no way ensure Putin success in the Ukrainian war or guarantee the US non involvement in the conflict.  

 

Trump wanted European NATO countries to increase their military budget and not rely solely on the US.

Trump wanted European countries to be energy independent from Russia. 

 

Trump wanted to pull out of NATO. OMG, Putin ally, confirmed. 

 

LOL. 

 

 

No, everyone didn’t see NATO as a dinosaur... Only Trump..all his senior staff told him as much that NATO is still very much needed. 

 

And yes.. Glad you agree Trump wanted to pull out of NATO just like I need. 

 

Edited June 25, 2023 by Goukosan

[Mr. House 3,371]

2 hours ago, Goukosan said:

 

No, everyone didn’t see NATO as a dinosaur... Only Trump..all his senior staff told him as much that NATO is still very much needed. 

 

And yes.. Glad you agree Trump wanted to pull out of NATO just like I need. 

 

I wasn't contesting your statement. 

 

NATO was a dinosaur, if anything Putin has did more to unite NATO members than any NATO country has done since the cold war ended. 

 

Regardless it's irrelevant because Ukraine isn't part of NATO. NATO countries aren't supporting Ukraine because of previous diplomatic agreements between two NATO nations. Your argument doesn't hold much weight.

[jehurey 3,299]

28 minutes ago, Ramza said:

I wasn't contesting your statement. 

 

NATO was a dinosaur

No it clearly isn't, if Russia was threatening multiple countries to NOT join them.

That's where you're argument comes to a dead stop.............by merely looking at what WAS RANKLING Putin to begin with: losing buffer countries to NATO.

 

That, alone, makes NATO worth its existence.

 

We're seeing the benefits right now...........America isn't have to shoulder everything, we have so many other countries coming in to help Ukraine out with weapons and money.

 

That single-handedly demonstrates why having NATO helps the United States.

[Goukosan 2,283]

32 minutes ago, Ramza said:

I wasn't contesting your statement. 

 

NATO was a dinosaur, if anything Putin has did more to unite NATO members than any NATO country has done since the cold war ended. 

 

Regardless it's irrelevant because Ukraine isn't part of NATO. NATO countries aren't supporting Ukraine because of previous diplomatic agreements between two NATO nations. Your argument doesn't hold much weight.

 

If you're not contesting my argument what the point of what you're saying?.... Oh yea you're just contesting shit I never said. 

 

 

NATO wasn't a dinosaur you imbecile. Putin would not dare to invade a NATO nation and that's the point.... The fact that would never do that because he knows he would get instantly curb stomped proved that it's working.. It's a deterrent... 

 

 

That's the same retarded logic Trump took when he disbanded the pandemic response team and removed the ban on gain of function research in 2018.

 

Bbbbbbut we're wasting money in preventing pandemics and outbreaks..nothing is happening we don't need it...... Bamn.... Pandemic happens. 

 

Samething with NATO.. Bbbbut we're wasting money.. We don't need NATO.. It's a relic... Bam.. Putin decides to inside Ukraine. 

 

And now like you said more NATIONS have joined NATO and it's stronger than ever. 

 

Putin's plan backfired

[Mr. House 3,371]

2 hours ago, Goukosan said:

 

If you're not contesting my argument what the point of what you're saying?.... Oh yea you're just contesting shit I never said. 

 

 

NATO wasn't a dinosaur you imbecile. Putin would not dare to invade a NATO nation and that's the point.... The fact that would never do that because he knows he would get instantly curb stomped proved that it's working.. It's a deterrent... 

 

 

That's the same retarded logic Trump took when he disbanded the pandemic response team and removed the ban on gain of function research in 2018.

 

Bbbbbbut we're wasting money in preventing pandemics and outbreaks..nothing is happening we don't need it...... Bamn.... Pandemic happens. 

 

Samething with NATO.. Bbbbut we're wasting money.. We don't need NATO.. It's a relic... Bam.. Putin decides to inside Ukraine. 

 

And now like you said more NATIONS have joined NATO and it's stronger than ever. 

 

Putin's plan backfired

We were talking in the context of attacking Ukraine. Putin is not attacking any NATO nation. If you want to argue NATIO effectiveness as a deterrent to Russia for NATO countries that's another topic entirely.  

 

The point is the US pulling out of NATO wouldn't really change anything in the context of Russian invading Ukraine as you seem to have implied in the first place. Not my fault your argumentation was flawed and stupid to begin with.

 

 

[Mr. House 3,371]

2 hours ago, jehurey said:

No it clearly isn't, if Russia was threatening multiple countries to NOT join them.

That's where you're argument comes to a dead stop.............by merely looking at what WAS RANKLING Putin to begin with: losing buffer countries to NATO.

 

That, alone, makes NATO worth its existence.

 

We're seeing the benefits right now...........America isn't have to shoulder everything, we have so many other countries coming in to help Ukraine out with weapons and money.

 

That single-handedly demonstrates why having NATO helps the United States.

You mean ex USSR states joining NATO such as Ukraine? That's different. 

 

What you think the only reasons why NATO countries are supporting this conflict with loans and weapons is because they are part of NATO? How?

 

Maybe some of the more reluctant countries but otherwise you'd have a very similar course of actions under the same idea of defending a democratic country that has been invaded without direct provocations.

 

Keep in mind the west only started sending serious aid once they realized the Ukrainians had a fighting chance and were kicking serious asses. Now it's the perfect proxy war to undermine Putin. Perfect proxy war to test out weapons and make the military industrial complex warmongers happy and rich. Perfect proxy war where they don't even have to send American soldiers to die on foreign soils. What a bargain. 

 

 

[Goukosan 2,283]

48 minutes ago, Ramza said:

We were talking in the context of attacking Ukraine. Putin is not attacking any NATO nation. If you want to argue NATIO effectiveness as a deterrent to Russia for NATO countries that's another topic entirely.  

 

The point is the US pulling out of NATO wouldn't really change anything in the context of Russian invading Ukraine as you seem to have implied in the first place. Not my fault your argumentation was flawed and stupid to begin with.

 

 

 

You're talking in circles with circular logic.... First you said NATO is a dinosaur..... Now you're saying Putin wouldn't attack any NATO nation... That's the fucking point of NATO dumbass

 

 

 

 

[Mr. House 3,371]

Just now, Goukosan said:

 

You're talking in circles with circular logic.... First you said NATO is a dinosaur..... Now you're saying Putin wouldn't attack any NATO nation... That's the fucking point of NATO dumbass

 

 

 

 

You're ignoring my main argument and obsessing over the fact I said NATO was a dinosaur for decades, which it was until last-year. Ok. 

[Goukosan 2,283]

44 minutes ago, Ramza said:

You mean ex USSR states joining NATO such as Ukraine? That's different. 

 

What you think the only reasons why NATO countries are supporting this conflict with loans and weapons is because they are part of NATO? How?

 

Maybe some of the more reluctant countries but otherwise you'd have a very similar course of actions under the same idea of defending a democratic country that has been invaded without direct provocations.

 

Keep in mind the west only started sending serious aid once they realized the Ukrainians had a fighting chance and were kicking serious asses. Now it's the perfect proxy war to undermine Putin. Perfect proxy war to test out weapons and make the military industrial complex warmongers happy and rich. Perfect proxy war where they don't even have to send American soldiers to die on foreign soils. What a bargain. 

 

 

 

First off, Ukraine is not getting America's best weapons, not even it's 2nd or 3rd best..... Second of all... No American soldiers will be taking part of this conflict as Ukraine is not a NATO nation and the US is not in a direct war with Russia. 

[Mr. House 3,371]

Just now, Goukosan said:

 

First off, Ukraine is not getting America's best weapons, not even it's 2nd or 3rd best.....

 

Second of all... No American soldiers will be taking part of this conflict as Ukraine is not a NATO nation and the US is not in a direct war with Russia. 

I never said they did, I said it was a testing ground, which it certainly is in some capacity. 

 

I just said the same thing. Are you fucking stupid? 

[Goukosan 2,283]

Just now, Ramza said:

You're ignoring my main argument and obsessing over the fact I said NATO was a dinosaur for decades, which it was until last-year. Ok. 

 

Bro you're dense beyond words.... The fact that it kept Russia in check for decades means it was/is working. 

 

How stupid are you? It's a deterrent. 

 

Like I said you're using the same stupid logic Trump used to disband the pandemic prevention/ response team and remove the ban om gain of function research..... Bbbbut we don't need it because we haven't had a pandemic in a century. 

 

The point is to prevent it.. 

[Goukosan 2,283]

6 minutes ago, Ramza said:

I never said they did, I said it was a testing ground, which it certainly is in some capacity. 

 

I just said the same thing. Are you fucking stupid? 

 

No it's not a testing ground for old ass weapons that were already used over a decade ago.  America won't even use those weapons they gave Ukraine if America was in direct conflict. 

 

The weaponry America have at our disposal right now is generations ahead of what they gave Ukraine. 

 

And those weapons aren't being used for this conflict.

 

This conflict has shown that Russia isn't actually a super power... They were supposed to be the world's 2nd best army? Pathetic. 

Edited June 25, 2023 by Goukosan